Lifted Mindset

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I'm curious, what PLO stake do you believe players can be clear winners in the games running today?

Check-jamming the turn doesn't really accomplish very much. We're really just flipping his value range and with the situation, I doubt he giving this much action with low flush cards.

I think I like the check-call on the turn. We can make better decisions on river cards.

The player took the lead and c-bet into 3 other players and his c-bet is decently big. Then keeps betting big on all streets.

If he has a set, I think it would only be top set (66xx) and he doesn't have many of those. We hold the flush cards that he would be bluffing with. I don't think he will take the betting lead with like a J-high flush but rather play more passively especially multi-way. Also if he had straight draws he would play them more passively and be afraid of the BB holding the nuts.

Even if we are at the top of our range, with the action he's given vs 3 players, I think he is holding the nuts 100% of the time. This is also a dangerous board to play blockers and I doubt he would even try in this situation.

TTJJ can flop middle or top set and less likely to flop bottom set, but also have the opportunity to flop straights or open-enders adding more equity to this hand. This is a hand that I wouldn't mind peeling. Our flush draw is okay as well if suited to the Jack.

But again, this is a high variance spot and if you decide to fold I wouldn't blame you. I think most players would call. How much gamble do you have in you? Haha. I personally would call and see a flop with this hand.

When things are not clear and they're not easy, the easiest thing to do is make excuses. What we need to do is put in MORE effort, MORE theory and MORE practice and at the same time LESS negativity.

You CAN beat it, that's all you need to know... But the real question you need to be asking is...

..Will you put in the work and effort to beat it?

First I would want to think about how active/aggressive the 3Bettor is. 4Bets at this stake are 95% of the time AAxx. I doubt the 3Bettor will 5B here since it's unlikely they both have AAxx but possible.

When we call, we will very often miss the flop or flop a flush draw. Both of which we don't really want to commit with but will have to. This hand can't flop straights either. If we do flop a set, it will almost always be bottom set leaving us with little odds to improve.

With those thoughts in mind. I think this is a hand that plays well in single raised pots but not well multi-way and it doesn't do well deep. We do not want to commit half of our stack with a mediocre hand and therefore I think we should throw it away.

We are too deep to raise here (176bb) and when he calls which he will, we will have a very hard time playing a big pot with this hand. When he does call or raise, we are in OKAY to bad shape. If we had closer to ~60bb I think we can raise. 70-100bb we can mix it up but I think call works well because he will check a good amount of turns and we are able to see a free card or possible showdown.

Hey,

I think after MP c-bets this board which really doesn't hit his range hard at all (we're holding the nut flush draw, the card which he should be holding in this spot) and then the BB raises on this board which hits his range the hardest. I feel we have a pretty annoying but clear fold.

I wouldn't donk any of my draws and this is exploitable once I fold.

I think you're right. But once we bet, we're not folding. We can bet small but will be lost on most turns. I think we either bet big or don't bet at all. Check/call is too difficult to play so I prefer a jam or shove.

I think a good "reasoning" behind bet sizings is to figure outhow many bluffs you have in that spot.

The more bluffs you have, the more you should bet. The less bluffs you have, the less you can bet. If the flop comes 3-3-8 dry compared to 4-4-5 with a flush draw, you don't need to bet as much on 3-3-8 because you already have a lot of fold equity. But it also depends on how you play your ranges. Some people will bet 33% and some people 66%. It depends if you like to barrel off with air or value bet very thin for value. Find out what you believe is the best strategy on boards and than create your own bet sizings to balance your strategy.

Yeah I think my thoughts were closer to what your explaining. I need some bluffs here and I thought this was the best one. It can have immediate fold equity on those cards and also have outs on rivers.

I'm starting to like a turn check/raise because like I said above. My hand now needs to be turned into a bluff and this is one of the best because of the immediate fold equity and I have outs when called.

Why do you hate this 3B? Would you not 3B AAxx double suited either OOP?

Thank you very much for your comment. I think when you said "Turning a value hand into a bluff OOP is a leak" I agree that my KKxx is a value hand and I would be betting it as a bluff on the turn. But if not this hand as a bluff, what hands would I be bluffing with on this turn?

But if he bets. I think a check/raise isn't bad here either. Once he bets, it's rare I have the best hand so now we need to turn it into a bluff and what better hand to bluff with than this one.

If he hits two pair on the turn on a 10 or a Q, that's still fine. I have blockers to the nuts and will now use them. When I c-bet the turn and the 10 or Q hits, I'll be at the bottom of my range by the river when I take this line and will be bluffing a third barrel on the blank rivers as a bluff.

If my had was AAxx instead of KKxx, I would check/fold when a 10 or a Q comes.