cyborg

Hey guys,

Haven't done much in the way of posting, but have been studying, playing and further acclimatizing to the format. I made the switch to regular games, and am currently winning at a higher bb/100 than I was at 200z, but with much less volume per hour, so still unsure if this is the correct avenue - will be reevaluating once a decent sample size is acquired. I also feel like moving from regular 200 tables to 400 tables will be much easier than 200z to 500z, so there's that.

I am winning at 4.23bb/100 over 50k hands, but am 14BI over EV, so that is definitely a concern - my WR is not where it wants to be. There is definitely some spew/leaks that are severely hurting my overall winrate, which are partly explained from being used to playing 80-95vpip in HUNL. I feel like by playing wide (perhaps too wide) on earlier streets in SH games, I get to certain decision points where my overall range is very wide and weak, and force myself to bluff because, well, it feels very unnatural to check down my obviously non-good high card.

Let me give an example;

We peel QThh in the BB vs BTN's 2.5x, flop is 8h42dd and we peel versus a 33% or 50% pot cbet, turn is Ko and goes checkcheck, river is an offsuit 9, so 842ddK9. We overbet.

Thoughts : we cannot valuebet lighter than Kx; but Kx+ should be good an incredibly high % of the time. I am not sure where to draw the line, stronger Ahighs might want to check and mostly lose, but feels like A3 and A5 might want to bluff, possibly all the way up to AT. Villain, on the other hand, should be incentivized to bluff heavily on a Kx turn, so we expect him to be very bluffcatcher heavy when the turn checks through (I am seeing a lot of regulars checkback A8-QQ in those spots, which feel like very clear valuebets to me).

Should we a)overbet with a wide range of bluffs (65o, 63s, 65s, AT-, any combination of cards QJ9 that had fd or bd) and with Kx+ for value, or b)bet small/block to target very weak parts of his range i.e. 55, 4x, etc and have some of our midstrength hands benefit from some value, cheap showdown, and not get bcb'd off our hand?

Feels like a) to me, and a great video by Nick Howard I watched this week (Pio Solver Explorations) reinforced that, assuming my interpretation of his thoughts is correct. There are a lot of spots where I find myself thinking "Wow, I have a lot of crap to get here, matter of fact, I currently am holding crap, and I have a very narrow value range to bet here. Oh well, want my damn chips back, overbet!" and I get this feeling like, ugh, this was spew even though it got through, I am highly likely to be unbalanced and exploitable here if I bet everything that cannot win at SD. Except I am not some GTO terminator from the future, nor am I playing one. Villain does not see my cards, does not know my exact range to get here, nor my betting strategies. Learn balance as a defense and as a means to better exploit, not as a mean to guilt trip myself for deviating from what I would estimate is an unexploitable line/bet.

I know that the earlier made-up hand example can be solved using a variety of software, and although I have little to no experience with any of them, I will figure it out by the next update and post my findings. My gut tells me that the solution will be a 75-100% pot bet, and not the overbet I chose to employ.

Upon leaving, I ask this random question : should you bluff hands that cannot win, even when the majority of your range is comprised of weak holdings, when facing an almost-capped range comprised of mostly made-hands/bluffcatchers, for a large sizing, or should you give up a lot, or fix the earlier street range as to make it not so weak on most runouts?

Thanks for reading guys, and godspeed!

cyborg

Thanks Dddog!

Definitely agree with you. Now that I am progressively more acclimatized to 6max games, more specifically 200nl, a raise of that size actually makes me unhappy to click call, nevermind reraising.

Let me thank you for the words of encouragement, and for the great content - I was recently introduced to your content, which came highly recommended by someone whose opinion I respect a lot. I have watched my first video by you, PIO Explorations and was heavily inspired.

In this vein, I would like to ask you a very quick question, if I may; assuming;

• A few years of playing (winning) experience at 200 and 400 HUNL (non-bumhunting, top tables on KOTH formats/zoom pool) and currently ;

• A basic understanding of poker theory, very basic understanding of GTO concepts (read Newall's TIPP);

• Very little done in the way of software (own a FlopZilla license and CRev, both have sat around close to unused - but that's about to change), purchasing a PIO license this week;

• Have Mathematics of Poker, Janda's and Tipton's EHUNL unread.

I truly appreciate the importance of DIY and finding my own path, but with so many places to throw myself at, I was interested in knowing if you had any recommendations on how to approach this new journey.

Thanks again for the words of encouragement!

Thanks a lot arsenalua! Much appreciated.

Thank you very much for taking the time to comment arsenalua. Here are some thoughts/questions I had with regards to your replies, specifially hand #1 and #5.

Hand #1

1a) Versus his exact hand, AKo, I have 25% equity (assuming I get to see two cards, which I probably won't very often) and am getting 4:1, so you are correct - it is probably an outright fold. I also ran my equity vs various betting ranges, and found that I actually did slightly better versus depolarized cbetting strategies :

Board: QcAsJd
Equity Win Tie
MP2 76.41% 75.86% 0.55% { AA, QQ-JJ, AQs+, AQo+ }
MP3 23.59% 23.04% 0.55% { JcTc }

Board: QcAsJd
Equity Win Tie
MP2 72.95% 71.56% 1.39% { TT+, ATs+, A5s-A4s, KJs+, QJs, AJo+, KQo }
MP3 27.05% 25.67% 1.39% { JcTc }

Board: QcAsJd
Equity Win Tie
MP2 74.64% 70.67% 3.97% { TT+, ATs+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, ATo+, KJo+, QJo }
MP3 25.36% 21.38% 3.97% { JcTc }

The number improves slightly in favor of JcTc if I start adding in suited wheels. It would appear that I am being crushed by both strategies, but that I give up slightly less vs the depolarized one.

1b) Versus a "standard" cbetting range of { AA, QQ-JJ, AQs+, AQo+ }, he gets to the river with 39.3% of straights (assuming he never bets them on the turn) and 7.14% flushes for a combined 46.44% autocall range. We are shoving 150 into 125 so we need the bluff to work 54% of the time, right around our BE point - assuming he never calls sets/2p. If he starts betting some straights and some TPNFD on the turn, surely we start making money (but, again, might start losing some if he starts clicking call with some sets).

1c) As far as sizing smaller (HPB) on the river, I am assuming it is because we want to be able to vbet straights - and actually get called by worse?

When I input our range that wants to bet the river AKo,AKs,KQs-KTs,QTs,JTs (I included QTs, JTs, A5s and A4s as bluffs), we still show up with a range of 61.3% straights and 9.68% flushes for a roughly 71% value range, meaning we would want villain to be indifferent to call 29% of the time? Meaning a 3/4 pot bet (88.75$ into 125$) would be best?

Hand #5

5a) I ran what is my best guesstimate of villain's range that gets to the river that contains at least a pair in it. You'll notice that it is considerably wide (minraising close to 100%) and very A-heavy (villain was particularly sticky on all streets so far, the match had been aggressive and I definitely sensed a bit of ego). This by no means is v's river calling range, just the hands that he gets there with :

AA,66-22,AKo-A2o,75o,54o,AKs-A2s,75s,64s,54s,43s

I discounted 65o and 65s which impacted his straight region from 24% to 19% because I felt strongly that given stack depth and dynamic, he would put in more action on earlier streets.

This leaves us with 19% straights, 5.17% weak pair, and a ~75% range that we beat outright (48.3% top pair, 20.7% 2p, 7% set).

Upon dissecting the hand, I definitely agree with you that from a balanced/optimal perspective, I can't vbet as low as 2pairs, and even 44 is possibly too thin for anything over 1/4 pot - although from an exploitative standpoint, I see this particularly villain calling 2p+ with near 100% frequency, and even the occasional TPGK.

This is the range that I perceive villain to pay off vs a sizing anywhere from 40% to 125% pot :

AA,55-22,A8o,A5o-A2o,75o,54o,A8s,A5s-A2s,75s,54s,43s

40.7% straights, 15% sets, 44.4% 2pairs.

If I give myself 44, and add all the 5xcc hands to his range, this is what we end up with :

AA,55-22,A8o,A5o-A2o,75o,54o,A8s,A5s-A2s,Kc5c,Qc5c,Jc5c,Tc5c,9c5c,8c5c,7c5c,5c4c,4c3c

We would be looking at 38% 2pair and 11.4% sets (about 4% of that is AA which has us beat) so we end up with around a 45% range that we beat, 52% chops and 3% lose (vs AA). When facing such a large portion of hands that we beat (45%), would we be correct in sizing up to as large an amount as we think most of his non-straight range will pay? How would I go about finding the correct sizing, from both an exploitative and from a GTO perspective?

Forgive me for such a long-winded reply; I had no intentions of it being this long when I started writing it, 3 hours ago. Again, your time and contribution to this thread are greatly appreciated. Thank you!

Fri August 19th

Videos watched :

Tyler Forrester's Calling in the BB & Check-raising the flop.

Great vids, that actually go hand in hand! What I have learned/reinforced is that a) I can probably increase my already high cold-calling out of the big and b)REALLY take the time in play to think about how a board hits villain's range, and figure out how many combinations can stand heat on multiple streets, and see if less-obvious combos of hands that can turn equity can make it into my x/r range. Thanks Tyler!

Sauce's 500z live vid

The symphony of factors being weighed almost instantly for every decision, and how quickly he comes up with a multi-street game plan is very inspiring. I am reluctant to use the word creative because I feel like a lot of the plays that seem very out-of-the-box to me, are standard-ish for Ben, possibly due to his ability to evaluate so many factors at just the right "weight".

Seeing stronger players run bad adds to my confidence, as bad as that sounds. Let me explain; it is easy to start questioning your game, and fall into sub-optimal plays when you are getting smashed. I've known this, but one can always use reinforcement. Just click the right button and reload!

Session

Tried my hand at regular tables, as I was told the higher winrate was worth foregoing the convenience of Zoom tables. I knew coming in that opening/closing tables and working the lobby as well as having to almost squint at the smaller tables may prove to be frustrating, but having that information and subsequently preparing myself mentally made the transition much easier, with little to no tilt. On the plus side, I got to play a lot of 2 & 3handed poker to start and close tables, although I am told that this might be a losing endeavor due to high rake. Any thoughts with regards to this are more than welcome; I plan to keep posting at all times for the moment, and leave the camping to others.

Results :

Played 2646 hands on Stars ring games for a profit of $1467 and ~250 hands of HU vs a regular on another network for a profit of $333. Some of the hands on Stars also ended up being 2-3 handed, but the overall win when filtered for 3+ players is $1180, so I am happy about that.

I maintained a 27.5vpip, 19.2pfr and 9.5 3bet when filtered for 3+. It is possible that I played too spewy given the ascending redline (from my brief experience playing ring games, it has been declining slightly as can be observed in the graph of my original post), although I don't recall too many spazzes. (Are ascending red lines obsolete in 2016?)

Hands

Losses :

https://www.weaktight.com/h/57b88f95d3904307338b4675

CO is a weaker player, BTN is reg, call preflop seems fine to me as well as flop call vs small sizing. River I felt was interesting; should I check and hope to win vs a small suited ace? In play it appeared to me that this was one of the worse hands that I got to the river with, and I unblocked the sets that I was targetting.

https://www.weaktight.com/h/57b8916ed390433a638b46c2

Vs regular. River seemed thin at first, but upon reflection I concluded that he was unlikely to slowplay turn with 2P/sets. No reads on villain's tendencies. From an exploitative standpoint, his river sizing made me want to just call, but I felt houses were unlikely enough to shove in the extra hundo in. In hindsight, I think this might have been overplay vs a player pool that probably doesn't always raise 98/Q9 vs a PSB on the river, most likely doesn't raise it 4x and most likely doesn't pay the rest off. Thoughts?

https://www.weaktight.com/h/57b88e9dd390431b368b4700

Vs regular. I mix in all three options preflop. Flop call seems mandatory, turn seemed almost mandatory to me having no hearts and with the T pairing.

Wins :

https://www.weaktight.com/h/57b89423d3904395628b46b5

Vs regular. Turn seems like a bet sometimes, check sometimes spot. Seemed like a fine hand to bet and then call, unblocking bluffs (I guess something with a 5 in it might be better? Or something with stronger equity although these will definitely remove some of his bluffs?). I do not expect villain to xr turn and give up river vs my perceived big club high card/2ndpair+OE type range, so was most likely calling any non-straightening river and potentially bluffraising on a 4flush, although mostly checking back vs a check on that same 4flush. Thoughts?

https://www.weaktight.com/h/57b896c0d39043554b8b4690

Vs same villain as previous hand. I think the hand is pretty standard on both ends, but was wondering if I had perhaps botched my river sizing. If I want to vbet as low as 32s (he was minraising), then I definitely can't get away with betting that size, although perhaps those are best thrown into a smaller sizing around 1/4 pot which can be used to fold out missed clubs?

Conclusion

Thanks a lot for reading guys. I try to do more playing on the weekends, and just got my subscription, so I haven't had the chance to check out the forums - perhaps the hands are best kept out of my journal and posted independently in the forums? Also, any advice on how to go about finding answers on the correct way to play hands are more than welcome. I have an old CRev license that I never used, Flopzilla I just started using recently, and heard the name Pio thrown around but haven't had the chance to check it out!

Thanks a lot for the words of encouragement! Good luck!