The_Kid_Alnz

loving the format. better than live play .

Good stuff Nick! Really like your teaching style. Would be great if you could include some Flopzilla and CREV in your future vids to look closer at the distributions and bet sizing options in some spots.

I don't expect many villians to 3b the flop w/ diamonds unless it's exactly 87dd, there's an outside chance he has 9xdd or QJdd but I'd say your behind OTT close to never. You have just over pot left so just jam the turn to protect your hand and for value. You want to force him to make a big fold or losing call with his sets and I expect most really bad players to do the latter.

Chael I understand that's not having a cold call range is the strategy most people play. At what amount of big blinds does that change? Generally what amount of big blinds would you say your strat should shift to having a cold call range. Seems too powerful for UTG+1 to 3b to say 11bb if UTG is never 4betting and the players behind are only VPIP'ing if they have AA and bluffs since they can only bluff a v small % of the time and stay balanced. Though maybe I'm underestimating how much the live ranges behind can defend.

What about something like live cash usually plays around 200-1000 bbs eff i can't imagine that the action going utg 3bb - UTG+1 11bb you should just fold everything but AA and then bluff a little bit. I know live players are generally weaker and don't read ranges aswell but what about in a tougher lineup with only a handful of fish, anywhere from 9 to 5 handed?

(edit sry if I'm clogging the thread maybe i should move these questions to another)

Thanks for the reply Peter. I have another question If KK is too weak to 4b for value how would you go about building a cold 4b/continue range in Samrostan and Crazy Elior spot in this hand/this action. Since you can't bluff cold call :) Is it ok to build a cold 4b range of AA and bluffs in their spot bc they have position? and then maybe have a balanced cold calling range (stuff like AK,KK etc)? 

Also Ben you mentioned in Phil's spot you would fold a lot and 4b occasionally. Can you expand on this?

villain will never have 44/66 (prob just 5b jams/folds) and maybe never 99 3betting from the SB here and flatting a 4b. We need to have some strong expo. reasons about villains 3b and peel a 4b range here to make checking the flop better than betting. Something like he would rarely flat TT-QQ but will always peel b/ws such that we can give free cards so he can improve to a hand we can extract some bets from or bluff later streets when we chk. His range should generally be pretty polarised OTR but its so unlikely were beat its probably best to let heroes be heroes.

Any exploitative reads on villain that make u want to chk flop? Rvr seems like a pretty clear jam. villains Qx will generally be AQs/o and KQo/s that he decided to 3b then peel a 4b maybe some suited Qx bluffs that decided to peel the 4b when getting such a gd price. We block AQ and villain deciding to chk rvr with Qx+ hands would be weird also.

Also Villain can't assume we have many Qx in our 4b range.

Nice post apotheosis. It's possible tho that Ivey has a more aggressive flop raising strat than only 22/33 for value (very strong 9x?). Intuitively c/c river seems best but Apo's post suggests otherwise.

The more i think about this hand the more i think Phil doesn't have AA. Since a lot of people seem to think AA is his most likely hand I wanted to ask a question about pre flop.

If we start at the first major decision point in the hand -  PFAs pre flop 3b of Phil's UTG open. PFA chooses roughly a 4x 3b and basically represents a very strong range. Say AA,KK,AKs maybe QQ for value, then some bluffs to balance like A5s, AJ/KQ type hands, some suited connector stuff whatever. Phil stated in the OP that he thought PFA would be wider than most but not by much. I'm assuming tho he doesn't think JJ is in that range, maybe some combos of AKo. Anyway it seems somewhat clear that vs that range we want to make the pot bigger and 4b w/ AA. We can't imagine PFA will make any tight folds with the value portion of that range, preflop at least. So now we get to go to the flop with more money in the pot and PFA will have to make some tough decisions over multiple streets with a lot of money in pot with his strong bluffcatchers like KK and risk either folding the best hand on some street to our 4b bluffs or calling down and losing a big pot.  

Ok tho Phil could be saying well if i 4b here 200bbs+ deep in these positions it polarizes my range and he can really put me on only AA maybe KK and the occasional bluff. So Im just gonna call everything and protect my 3b calling range so its not capped and not 4b so he's not so clairvoyant of my range. Phil would also maybe get to add more value combos to his flop CR ranging on certain boards textures permitting like the J43 flop here and PFA might make more of a mistake with hands like KK and his 3b bluffs so that AA possibly becomes higher EV.

Since a lot of you guys seem to think AA is his most likely hand why do u think strat B (calling pre) is the highest EV one even if we run the risk of losing value somewhere or getting outdrawn post by his bluffs? Seems to me vs this 3b sizing at 200bbs we should have a 4b range? If the highest EV play with AA is to 4b then optimally we should choose that one right? Should we ever play a mixed strat w/ AA here?

We also have Phil's flop x/r and turn check. If we did play AA like this up until the turn should we even chk the Q turn? QQ improves to better but thats about it. If we think QQ is in his PFAs 3b range pre isn't that more reason to 4b? 

Apotheosis presented a decent argument on checking AA on the Q turn. Just wondered if anyone could expand on the turn line we should take here. 

Cool thread interested to hear Phil's thoughts on the hand and what he had.

Yes the sizing is pretty big pre (4.166x) but it doesn't seem that unreasonable with all things considered. He's committed to the 2 short stacks behind whatever size he uses. Maybe he feels expo. that crazy elior and samo with (207 eff and 187 bbs) will play bk either by 4b or calling a lot less frequently vs a sizing that seems stronger. He could also be under the assumption that phil likes to defend a very wide range when getting a gd price with deep stacks so if he cuts down his odds slightly he can put phil on a more defined range making things look better for him postflop. Not really much to add just that the fact most people see the sizing as huge could sway some frequencies of players ranges in favour of the villain.

you should probably just flat this pre as a default at 51bbs eff. turn is likely a check vs what i'd assume his range is. Its always going to be a marginal/tough turn spot vs someone that u don't have much history with or great reads on.

all streets are very marginal. run some equities vs what you think the guys range is by the turn and figure out if u can continue.His range will likely be pretty narrow in a 4/5 way pot w/ 2 fish.

haha weird hand Phil! eq.fest's post looks pretty gd. For you to take this line it looks like u either missed a double x/r or checked turn for some other explo. reason with a value hand or that u somehow improve on the offsuit T river with some of your bluffs. 89ss/dd usually barrel turn but i guess QTss or AKss could conceivably be played like this. 

plz help

wat is a R?