BadBeatLust

I don't really think he's bluffing at this point.

CO is next to go through the blinds and with ICM being a massive factor at this point because pay jumps are cray this seems very much an induce for either you or the opener to jam.

If he had a hand like AQ, 88-JJ I think he would jam instead, but I'm most certain that he has QQ+, AK+ in that particular spot.

As both above said, its hard to know what to do with no reads.

Based on what I'm seeing though its a fold, it looks too induce-y to me.

But with good reads I think its an auto-jam.

What Jason said oddly cynically :P

You want to isolate the limper, I would personally iso-jam up to TT there and considering JJ depending on the villain & rest left to act.

But say you do the mistake of limping behind, when you see a call on an 8bb jam just fold 77 since you have a very decent stack for a 180 at the time.

Cheers.

It is not a risk to be honest with you, its pretty standard.

Now, if first jam was 15BBs and rejam was 25BBs I could have found a fold with AKo because I know that I'm only ahead by a tiny margin of the first villain.

If you put yourself in the 2nd villain's seat you would see that he's rejamming with a premium range I think.

Cheers.

Agree with everything ivanb said plus some range modification:

* I'm never calling anybody I don't have a 101% sure read on with lower than AQo, 99+ for 20 bigs, It doesn't matter if you have A9o A9s J3o or 72o you will still fold, calling with A9o in that spot is a heavenly gift to someone who notices you are active.

*Now, If you find someone(like me perhaps :p) who plays 32/31/11 then with perfect ranging you might call but the above calling lines don't change much, maybe get lowered to AJo and 88+ and that is a 4% increase for 10% more aggressiveness in the villain.

*You can see for yourself that you make too much money by opening any 2 and getting Blinds&Antes which means that squeezing tiny +cEV edges won't make much difference even in the long run because we are talking borderlines at the moment.

I hope I helped.

Cheers.

@z0fman: Believe me it is not obvious at all, esp in the 2.5$ 180s people limp all the time with crap like broadways, suited connectors etc. Only the regs will know that I got a small pp and even then if I see many regs at the table I'll never trap, totally pointless at T20-T200.

@serbie: At T100 it is incorrect to jam 15BBs with 22-77 you will never get called by worse and you are not getting the correct odds.

I think I prefer jamming here.

Since you are 2nd in chips atm, I give the CL a 5-10% chance he flats an open from you, after that if some1 rejams then you are fine because you will rejam as well but if everyone else folds and you have a dry board what do you do, C-bet/pray/fold or check/fold?

And you also have the chance since you are in MP to catch some shortie with quite possibly a worse ace where he will almost certainly punt it or even a rejam from the CL.

Since thats ur image then then its a pass for sure, chip lead in the 180s can change in a heart beat, i've won games where I was a 8:1 or worse dog and lost them while I was 8:1 ahead because depending on their reads, people can reshove over the button shove(say the button does jam in that spot) lighter than they would and then it will make ur play --cEV.

If that was a 18 man thats another thing then ur play is correct, but in a 180 where jumps are bigger its just not worth it I think.

Jokin btw if some1 doesnt get it :p

@computerscreen Have you?

If you are a reg then the 1st question should not be there unless you are on a FT bubble. You always go for max $$ and ICM makes no difference except the FT, and even then only probably the top 4-5 spots.

Also, sometimes when deep in a MTT, the last question is irrelevant as well.
Say you are the overwhelming CL with 12 left in a tournament and BB has <12bbs. You must jam there atc so hand is really not important.

Other than that, nice post :)

If you had a single reg left in that FT he would have pwned that limp 60-70% of the time.

You are way off better open-calling the btn rather and folding to everyone else since T3o plays more shitty than 75o and you can fold vs a 7-10bb 3b rejam since it plays so bad.

Don't feel committed because they have a <=10bb stack because they prolly rejam about 30% there and even with that in mind you don't get the odds to call with T3o.

1. Since you are only going to play SnGs and not MTTs variance is not bigger(harder is incorrect as a word here) its definitely smaller since the fields are easier.

Truth be told, if you can't beat the micros you can't beat middle or bigger.

Nonsense such as "I off better playing with better players because they can understand what I'm doing when I'm doing it" are wrong because better players can maybe understand you but they can read through your heart so don't bet on that you are going to win on bigger stakes.

2. Your bankroll size depends on what kind of SnGs you are going to play.

For instance, if you want to play just 9-max regular speed SnGs you probably need 50BI's to start with(i.e if SnG has 1E Buy-In you need 50E in your br.) but if you want to play higher variance SnGs such as turbos and hyper turbos you need for example 100 BI's for turbos and 200BI's for hyper-turbos because variance can be a big factor in these games.

3. Say you are playing at 1E 9-max tables and you have 120E in your account. For you to move up to the 3E ones you need 150E approximately.

If you go, lets say, under 75E you might want to start playing 1E games again in order to build up your bankroll once more.

4. I would say you would need around 4-5k games in order to show if you want to say that you beat the stake you are currently playing.

I hope I helped.

And mostly with hands that are not worth calling a 3b jam with, bottom 40% hands etc. which you can dump as soon as you see a raise.

Stack sizes might be low but since you say every1 is very tight you don't have to risk an awful lot to gain chips man.

Raise/folding with a 15bb stack can amass a huge amount of chips over a long term period and with antes in play its a huge edge you can have against regs especially.

Well if you play every day for a week you can see the results but not if you play 2 or 3 to be honest.

If they are single table SnGs and I'm guessing the payouts are 50/30/20 then with a bit ICM work and correct reads on regs they are pretty beatable, on a bigger rate than the online STTs I may add.

But again, as Schu said, to show a decent profit you have to play a big amount of them.

Then its a snap call mate.

First guy should be jamming about 35% of his range and the 2nd guy if he's half decent about 20% that means JJ is a monster there. Also there's nowhere near ITM and you don't have to fear anything.

In that spot I'm calling with 99+ and AJo++.

All you have to do in order not to get feared is just play according to the math mate. Leave emotional decisions at a minimum.

And if your hand doesn't hold so what? Poker is a long-term game not a 1 tournament one.

By the stack sizes I'm guessing that is a turbo.

Before I answer properly, can you provide some info on the kind of MTT BI, stage any notes on the villains etc.?

If opponent is half-decent I would probably make it a bit bigger on the flop but if he's just a random I would make it even smaller because it just wouldn't matter what we bet there since our aim is to take it down there and if he hasn't hit or have a draw (KJ etc.) he will fold.

I agree with Jason on the fact that we don't c/f every turn but its still an option when a 9+ card comes.

I disagree with the fact that 3x is better than 2.5x because it then seems that all we want to do is take the pot down there and if the opponent is anywhere close to paying attention you could get 3b a decent amount of times.

Oh and opening them, especially in EP/MP is -cEV because you can get called by many people and there's just nothing to steal pre flop.

Well for one, you don't have as much time waiting around in a 180 as you have in an MTT stack size-wise.

Secondly, once you get to jam/fold stage avg stack lets say at BB250 is around 3.2-3.7k so that would be 13-15bbs.

You are 25 minutes into the tournament and you might have blinded down to a 1k stack because of no profitable spots.

I have found that in general, people in SnGs are more careless with their stack and punt it off too easily.

That's why I have found that limping first 2 levels with 22-77 is +$EV, because you can easily stack off 2 people and have a dominating stack which will be very useful if you can't find any other spots until the antes come into play.

I would link a hand history that shows that but atm a bit hard because I'm not on my grinding pc.

Gr8 video Phil, only have one question which is a bit irrelevant to your lines.

How come you don't use a HUD?

Also, you have to take into account the capabilities of your Computer.

If you lack in RAM and are a bit broke, I would stick to just 1 room at a time because of the amount of cache memory took up by the HUDs.

I got 8GBs of RAM in my Mac and even that sometimes struggles to load up the HUD in 20-25 tables.

I'm not a HS MTT player but I occasionally I do play on different sites.

Multi-tabling is nowhere near as tough as Multi-"rooming".

I'm currently using a Mac(don't ask why I enjoy apples :p) and have a parallel desktop with most of the times just stars opened.

If I'm not playing any SnG's/180s I'd stick to 10-14 MTT's trying to focus on the Reg Speeds because I got much more leaks there than the turbos.

In my mind an optimal grinding spot would be 2x21" monitors since I prefer stacking and dont need much space but I would have both of them open in order to play the high value stuff on other Rooms.

But then again, its all about what your goals/aim is at the time. E.g if its WCOOP/SCOOP month I wouldn't want anything but stars opened since at the time most of the MTTs(esp the "special" ones) are filled with "CMON ONE TIME" players.

Done, have fun judging me :D

Aha ok :) I'll try and finds something around the 20$-30$ range but 95% its gonna be a turbo because I don't like reg speeds much :D I'll send it over asap cheers

Yo Jono, you want to specify anything e.g BI range, speed etc.?

But there is still a lot more $$ to be taken from the fishies, although truth be told variance is increasing by the day because of the amount of regs that are now playing almost exclusively 180s.

Thats a bit general I think.

2s, 3rs and 8s run around the clock with the 2s a bit more on non-peak hours.

15$ and higher ain't dead its just that most of the people that used to play them thinking they have a nice prize up top realized that after 500$ spent they have 1 min cash and 3 bubbles.

At peak hours you can see that 2s load up in less than 3(maybe 2 if its a weekend) minutes and the rest range from 5-10 depending on the day as well.

You are all talking of reg speeds though.

There is a general consensus that turbos, especially the high BI ones are of more variance than reg speeds.

You will find though that if you take all the small edges possible vs fish and most Reg Speed regs and add them up, you will find that in the end, Turbos are possible to have smaller variance than Reg speeds.

Playing a high variance style means in terms of Game Theory taking a big risk which pays off a big reward.

Problem is that with the RNG&the huge fields involved you can end up being massively +cEV but still coming up short.

That means that playing LAG when you are CL or just Table CL is profitable in a lot of ways because all TAGs do effectively waiting around for an 8% hand and going with it.

Again as Jono said above, its all about punting stacks when its simply not worth it ICM-wise, because yeah he does play 25/22/9 over 2k hands but still he can show up with AA and you will bust 80% of the time.

Last but not least, I totally agree /w Scott on the Top 3 fact. If there wasn't for min-cashing we all wouldn't have a br to play with.

Cheers.