Hey, Sick hand with 89s against 8T^^
1 question. It seems like you prefer smaller cbets when we are having wider ranges, opening from co/btn, and bigger sizes from EP etc. Mainly against BB defend. Can you please explain why?
The weaker your range is the smaller you want to bet playing a balanced strategy (of course it can change depending on different textures)
By betting smaller a lot of As highs or weak pairs become valuebets instead of valuffs, playing from Early or Middle position our range is stronger (ip) so we usually prefer to bet bigger.
I just ran a sim for HJ vs BTN on 862r, which you encountered in your video. I think FlaXmarZ was referring to this spot. I gave IP tree Cbet szings - 33, 52 and 82. Pio chose the small sizing 82% of the time, almost never betting bigger.
I would like to challenge your logic on how to select the cbet sizing in these spots. I dont think how strong our overall range is(do you mean equity?) affect sizing that much. Instead I think it plays a huge rule in determining our frequency. In this exact spot IP dont have a nut advange because both players have all the sets and OOP also have 86s - therefore not allowing IP to choose big sizings with a high frequency. In addition IP needs a lot of protection and therefore wants to bet with a very high frequency so far as IP's equity-advantage allows IP to do so.
20:47, I slightly disagree. At first glance it seems to make sense to play GTO when your opponent is doing weird 'unknown things'. However, reg or not, we know for sure that he is making very bad calls (no amount of soul reading can justify that T8 call). Therefore at the time of the adjustments on the flop with 46s we SHOULD be playing exploitative by obviously bombing thin value and only bluffing with strong bluffs. Like, we should be bombing any pair on the flop expecting a call from any Ace. If we assume he's definitely fishy and possibly tricky too, you're still more likely to be ahead of his calling range. Turns out he is a bit tricky, and had the top of his range, but I still think he's fishy and you should be betting thin value if you had it.
If he is a reg we have no idea how he is playing against us after that hand, I agree with your point, T8 is a way too bad call to give him any credit but... I prefer to be cautious specially when I am making a public video about the hand ^^
all bluffcatchers are indifferent at equalibrium(ignoring blockers). T8s from blockers perspective is probably zero EV call in that spot it all depends how he structures his range, and what does he think of you. If he thinks you are overbluffing, that call from 0 EV quickly increases into positive.
Why not? He is not going to be insta betting his value so timing tells there are pretty useless.
He can be thinking about betting thin for value as well
It depends what size you use, the bigger you raise the less hands you should open, I recomend you to use Snowie for the preflop ranges and sizings. T9s is the lowest unless I am opening 2.25x - 2.5x
The blinds in party are 10 - 25 so 12 bigblinds, I am trying to create smaller SPR´s, it will make easier my game postflop with overpairs and top pairs and I am giving to him worst odds with pocket pairs, suited conectors etc.
I can´t say this strategy is the best option, I am still exploring the benefits of stronger 3bet sizings... hehe
13 minute 662 board or something like that. you are between betting your standard size and overbetting river, why not overbet? villian is capped and if we defend flop wide(obv. we do) we have ton of floats which want to maximaze EV. I guess max EV size with many bluffs is big.
And it is nl2k, not nl200 where people will level them self to call because odds are looks good and your possible have bluffs. If you have only that size and have less bluffs, totally reasonable and agree with you size.
p.s. nice stuff, coach with emotion is much better than robots ^^
His range was polarized on the flop, this is not the kind of spot for overbets with a hand like KK Imo, if I think he is not calling never with a bluffcatcher probably I should bluff overbet explo, the smaller I bet he must call more often and that´s important as well, I dont think he will do a mistake by calling my size, the thought you did about a nl200 player it´s the same thought they should do in nl2k, anyone is folding always against this size because they play nl2k and not nl200 or something like that imo
Those are my thoughts but maybe you are right ^^ Regards!
Some Questions regarding preflop ranges. (kind of long...)
I heard that you said you should have folded 67s preflop from that position. And your just in the mood to play and of course that's fine. It happens to me too more than often... so
My question here is:
If we are on the CO. And the BTN is a weak tight reg that doesn't give us any trouble, the blinds are deepstacked fishes that calls a lot OOP.
I figured we can open up our CO raising range. (When I used to play mostly online I just play a solid, and mostly static range preflop with the occasional loosening up because the games are much tougher than live poker. - which I'm playing now)
Do you think its +ev to open up from CO or even MP given the above described scenario is true? And if true, how do we figure out how wide exactly we should open up our range? like your hand with 67s. When can we justify opening 56s, or 45s from CO? How could we figure out the exact range cutoff of hands that we just don't open pre?
An issue with this is, if we mess around with our preflop range, and get 3bet. It will hard to determine what ranges defend with a dynamic preflop range. We may open up to being exploited by not defending enough, or defending too much. Also going to the flop in a 3bet pot with a range that we are unfamiliar with opens up to even more exploitation.
What is the best way to create non-static preflop opening range. Is it correct to just familiarize myself with wider opening ranges + wider defending ranges if we face 3bets?
And also know our "standard" opening ranges/ defending ranges.
^^ if you think the above is how we should approach this issue.
How do we construct an exact range to open up? Like from CO we open 67s, but what about 45s,56s. How do we determine exactly which hand is the exact cut off point where we don't open at all? I think our range needs to be precise because only then can we figure out our defense frequencies vs 3bets.
Because obviously opening 45s from CO as a standard in a normal 100bb game is probably -ev even if the blinds are bad players.
(Also I ask this because I used to play standard online 100bb games, I'm familiar with ranges I should play/ defend in these games. But now I'm playing live super deep games. Usually 200bb-600bb deep guys sitting at the tables with a lot of loose callers. Some with aggression but most are passive preflop)
Would you create two different ranges for these games? If so, how would you approach constructing two different preflop ranges being deepstacked. One for standard opening ranges vs competent regs / unknowns. And another one range for exploitative like the CO example I suggested above.
Or would you just keep one standard range for deepstacked, and one static range for 100bb stacks and not have two different ranges based on table player positioning?
Totally honest. I always try to open the same range because playing 100bbs the edge preflop doesn´t make the OR worth it.
When you open more than what you should you definetely are creating leaks, you need to care about those things + the attention of playing that hand postflop, all that energy is better to use it on other hands you might be playing where you can make a real difference in your Winrate, this is specially important playing online. Totally different if you are just in the mood and enjoying the game hehe
About how to build preflop ranges I definetely recomend Pokersnowie, it´s the strongest program for this: http://www.pokersnowie.com/248.html
There isn´t any other option as far as I know to get a close estimation of what hands we should play preflop.
sick video and it's good to have some humour in your vids alongside some serious strategy.
the games looked very bad though, do you usually play with all regs or was that just because there was nothing running and you wanted to make a vid? I mean of course for us viewers it's best to watch you battle vs some great regs but not so much for your bb/100 :P
also at 26:00 you cold call the 3 bet with TT, what is your thinking behind this? it seems pretty hard to balance as we just usually have 99-JJ and perhaps AQ, and it allows the other 2 in to the pot with good pot odds as well as position over you and the 3 bettor. is it not better and easier to just have a cold 4 bet/ fold range? to deny open raiser and flatter a good price to flat as well as to take away their potential positional advantage, also, typically, a SB 3 betting range is one of the widest from any position, so we can isolate the SB and keep our range uncapped post flop. as when the A comes on the turn it is just terrible for our range as we don't have many Ax at all, and he has a ton of Axs as well as big Ax both off suit and suited. so we probably end up not being able to defend anything like enough OTT vs that small sizing.
because I was thinking okay maybe we balance this cold call range with AA, but then in a similar spot towards the end of the video we have AA in the BB vs a SB 3 bet and you say 'of course we are going to 4 bet' implying that we never flat here.
I can understand us perhaps wanting a cold call 3 betting range IP, vs an EP open and CO/ HJ 3 bet as these ranges are very strong and we also have the added benefit of getting to play in position when they may turn their range face up on certain boards post flop. but OOP I can't see many benefits to having this as part of our arsenal.
of course perhaps I am way off and you have a good win rate when doing this.
but yeah, great video and looking forward to the next one!
I usually play shitty games because I like to battle, not smart definetely but now I am creating content online so I hope I can make money other ways to compensate the lack of edge on some tables I play. Anyway by doing this I think I will learn faster and my goal is to become one of the strongest regs regardless of the money.
26 min: What happens is that you cant cold4bet all your range and never call because that will create a leak when he decides to go all in, I will have way too many bluffs. Second we can´t study propertly 3waypots unless we use snowie and this program has call range on this kind of situations. (by the way we are IP against SB, that´s a huge part of the decision, totally OOP I would cold4bet / fold a lot more often.
About the fold on the turn, no problem, I have other hands that can make the call.
Fine ;) here it goes. Basicly Mike Sexton was hired to get partypoker of the ground and up and running. Main bases of the site where some place in india. He got theré and like the first thing he needed to do was to help them find a name for the site. (They Only had casinogames at this point in time) and they kinda random had named the site partypoker. When he got there they handed him a list of suggestions of potential names for the site. But he basicly threw the list away and said we keep partypoker cause its sounds fun and is easy to remember ^_^
Nice video again!
About the big 89s hand vs isildur, why did you say you prefer check with J9 , cause maybe it has better blocking capabilitys blocking AJ ?
A little humor goes a long way with training vids. I see and appreciate the effort.
If you wouldn't mind, could you please shed a little light on the ranges you have on the slider above your desk? I don't play much online and am just curious what they are and how you use them while playing.
They are just a compilation of ranges preflop I built with Snowie and Pio solver preflop, If I am not sure if I want to play a hand against a particular size I can use them.
Hi I have another question for you if that's OK, you seem to advocate betting different sizes with different parts of your range, isn't that much easier for good players to exploit? I would like to know your opinion on choosing the same bet size with your entire range, and why you choose not to do this. Thank you!
Actually I do sizings depending on the texture of the boards, not the hand value, on some boards I have mixed strategies but I always take care of betting with a balanced range
i hope this was elias choice 2 leave and not runitonce - if its runitonce choice this is the worst decision ever made by this company.
his videos are the best and most enjoyable on the site, he can even play 5c/10c for all i care and i would prefer watching his content than 60% of the other outdated/boring coaches on this site.
im sorry i had 2 word it that way but its true, there is no enjoyable content on this site anymore & elias content was by far miles above the rest of the coaches.
How many sizing of iso raising you have vs limp SB ? Are you sure that you always raise preflop 4x all the value hands that you have on the river ? Seems that sometimes you are 3.5x.
Hey bro, nice video, very entertaining format and clean information. The ideia of using just one screen gives it a great style as you skip the shitty hands. Keep going, count with our support. Regarding ideas from new videos, what do you think to make something in micro limits?
When counting the combos of value and bluffs on the T8 v 98, your assumptions is that you ch flop vs miss cb 100% on AQxcc but having some AQ in your range + the fact he misses cb, i think you should (or Must?) have a prob range flop, what do you think ?
Therefore i would exclude AQ and 66 from your range and maybe as a bluff 87dd or 98dd or JTs ?
Hi, I'm a little confused because I usually tend to do the opposite about the sizings. I think when I have a stronger range I bet smaller to incentivize calls, but a higher frequency since my range is strong, and when my range is weaker I mix checking and bigger sizing frequencies.
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hey dude!
Hey, Sick hand with 89s against 8T^^
1 question. It seems like you prefer smaller cbets when we are having wider ranges, opening from co/btn, and bigger sizes from EP etc. Mainly against BB defend. Can you please explain why?
Nice vid
The weaker your range is the smaller you want to bet playing a balanced strategy (of course it can change depending on different textures)
By betting smaller a lot of As highs or weak pairs become valuebets instead of valuffs, playing from Early or Middle position our range is stronger (ip) so we usually prefer to bet bigger.
Regards!
Hi Elias
I just ran a sim for HJ vs BTN on 862r, which you encountered in your video. I think FlaXmarZ was referring to this spot. I gave IP tree Cbet szings - 33, 52 and 82. Pio chose the small sizing 82% of the time, almost never betting bigger.
I would like to challenge your logic on how to select the cbet sizing in these spots. I dont think how strong our overall range is(do you mean equity?) affect sizing that much. Instead I think it plays a huge rule in determining our frequency. In this exact spot IP dont have a nut advange because both players have all the sets and OOP also have 86s - therefore not allowing IP to choose big sizings with a high frequency. In addition IP needs a lot of protection and therefore wants to bet with a very high frequency so far as IP's equity-advantage allows IP to do so.
I would love to hear your thoughts on this :-)
20:47, I slightly disagree. At first glance it seems to make sense to play GTO when your opponent is doing weird 'unknown things'. However, reg or not, we know for sure that he is making very bad calls (no amount of soul reading can justify that T8 call). Therefore at the time of the adjustments on the flop with 46s we SHOULD be playing exploitative by obviously bombing thin value and only bluffing with strong bluffs. Like, we should be bombing any pair on the flop expecting a call from any Ace. If we assume he's definitely fishy and possibly tricky too, you're still more likely to be ahead of his calling range. Turns out he is a bit tricky, and had the top of his range, but I still think he's fishy and you should be betting thin value if you had it.
If he is a reg we have no idea how he is playing against us after that hand, I agree with your point, T8 is a way too bad call to give him any credit but... I prefer to be cautious specially when I am making a public video about the hand ^^
all bluffcatchers are indifferent at equalibrium(ignoring blockers). T8s from blockers perspective is probably zero EV call in that spot it all depends how he structures his range, and what does he think of you. If he thinks you are overbluffing, that call from 0 EV quickly increases into positive.
Next time don't spend 2 minutes counting whether you have enough value hands in the spot to cover your bluff =))
Why not? He is not going to be insta betting his value so timing tells there are pretty useless.
He can be thinking about betting thin for value as well
was joking lol ^^
28:20 67suited is a fold in mp you say.
Whats the lowest SC you recomend opening as default, do you work with pio preflop? I thougt its a std open.
It depends what size you use, the bigger you raise the less hands you should open, I recomend you to use Snowie for the preflop ranges and sizings. T9s is the lowest unless I am opening 2.25x - 2.5x
8s are considered lucky in China, therefore 888poker
uhm Interesting, especially because 888poker was created by an israeli business man I believe :S
He was obviously aiming at the Chinese market when he did that, duh!
Smart :P Ty I didn´t know it
You where right about partypoker that's exactly how it went down xD
Lets make Another comment while im at it. If u read or listen to Mike Sextons book (great read btw) u will find out how partypoker got its name... ;)
-.-
Tell me.
In the hand where you 3bet AK on party at 27:45, why did you choose a 6x size? Thanks :)
The blinds in party are 10 - 25 so 12 bigblinds, I am trying to create smaller SPR´s, it will make easier my game postflop with overpairs and top pairs and I am giving to him worst odds with pocket pairs, suited conectors etc.
I can´t say this strategy is the best option, I am still exploring the benefits of stronger 3bet sizings... hehe
oh yes I meant 6x his initial raise, but anyway thank you for the interesting response
13 minute 662 board or something like that. you are between betting your standard size and overbetting river, why not overbet? villian is capped and if we defend flop wide(obv. we do) we have ton of floats which want to maximaze EV. I guess max EV size with many bluffs is big.
And it is nl2k, not nl200 where people will level them self to call because odds are looks good and your possible have bluffs. If you have only that size and have less bluffs, totally reasonable and agree with you size.
p.s. nice stuff, coach with emotion is much better than robots ^^
His range was polarized on the flop, this is not the kind of spot for overbets with a hand like KK Imo, if I think he is not calling never with a bluffcatcher probably I should bluff overbet explo, the smaller I bet he must call more often and that´s important as well, I dont think he will do a mistake by calling my size, the thought you did about a nl200 player it´s the same thought they should do in nl2k, anyone is folding always against this size because they play nl2k and not nl200 or something like that imo
Those are my thoughts but maybe you are right ^^ Regards!
thank you, it concerns me, so I will definitely improve that situation.
Some Questions regarding preflop ranges. (kind of long...)
I heard that you said you should have folded 67s preflop from that position. And your just in the mood to play and of course that's fine. It happens to me too more than often... so
My question here is:
If we are on the CO. And the BTN is a weak tight reg that doesn't give us any trouble, the blinds are deepstacked fishes that calls a lot OOP.
I figured we can open up our CO raising range. (When I used to play mostly online I just play a solid, and mostly static range preflop with the occasional loosening up because the games are much tougher than live poker. - which I'm playing now)
Do you think its +ev to open up from CO or even MP given the above described scenario is true? And if true, how do we figure out how wide exactly we should open up our range? like your hand with 67s. When can we justify opening 56s, or 45s from CO? How could we figure out the exact range cutoff of hands that we just don't open pre?
An issue with this is, if we mess around with our preflop range, and get 3bet. It will hard to determine what ranges defend with a dynamic preflop range. We may open up to being exploited by not defending enough, or defending too much. Also going to the flop in a 3bet pot with a range that we are unfamiliar with opens up to even more exploitation.
What is the best way to create non-static preflop opening range. Is it correct to just familiarize myself with wider opening ranges + wider defending ranges if we face 3bets?
And also know our "standard" opening ranges/ defending ranges.
^^ if you think the above is how we should approach this issue.
How do we construct an exact range to open up? Like from CO we open 67s, but what about 45s,56s. How do we determine exactly which hand is the exact cut off point where we don't open at all? I think our range needs to be precise because only then can we figure out our defense frequencies vs 3bets.
Because obviously opening 45s from CO as a standard in a normal 100bb game is probably -ev even if the blinds are bad players.
(Also I ask this because I used to play standard online 100bb games, I'm familiar with ranges I should play/ defend in these games. But now I'm playing live super deep games. Usually 200bb-600bb deep guys sitting at the tables with a lot of loose callers. Some with aggression but most are passive preflop)
Would you create two different ranges for these games? If so, how would you approach constructing two different preflop ranges being deepstacked. One for standard opening ranges vs competent regs / unknowns. And another one range for exploitative like the CO example I suggested above.
Or would you just keep one standard range for deepstacked, and one static range for 100bb stacks and not have two different ranges based on table player positioning?
Totally honest. I always try to open the same range because playing 100bbs the edge preflop doesn´t make the OR worth it.
When you open more than what you should you definetely are creating leaks, you need to care about those things + the attention of playing that hand postflop, all that energy is better to use it on other hands you might be playing where you can make a real difference in your Winrate, this is specially important playing online. Totally different if you are just in the mood and enjoying the game hehe
About how to build preflop ranges I definetely recomend Pokersnowie, it´s the strongest program for this: http://www.pokersnowie.com/248.html
There isn´t any other option as far as I know to get a close estimation of what hands we should play preflop.
Regards!
love that you played on 888 and party......anything but stars...thanks
Party ok, but 888 the rake is a scam worst than pokerstars Imo, we live in difficult times
sick video and it's good to have some humour in your vids alongside some serious strategy.
the games looked very bad though, do you usually play with all regs or was that just because there was nothing running and you wanted to make a vid? I mean of course for us viewers it's best to watch you battle vs some great regs but not so much for your bb/100 :P
also at 26:00 you cold call the 3 bet with TT, what is your thinking behind this? it seems pretty hard to balance as we just usually have 99-JJ and perhaps AQ, and it allows the other 2 in to the pot with good pot odds as well as position over you and the 3 bettor. is it not better and easier to just have a cold 4 bet/ fold range? to deny open raiser and flatter a good price to flat as well as to take away their potential positional advantage, also, typically, a SB 3 betting range is one of the widest from any position, so we can isolate the SB and keep our range uncapped post flop. as when the A comes on the turn it is just terrible for our range as we don't have many Ax at all, and he has a ton of Axs as well as big Ax both off suit and suited. so we probably end up not being able to defend anything like enough OTT vs that small sizing.
because I was thinking okay maybe we balance this cold call range with AA, but then in a similar spot towards the end of the video we have AA in the BB vs a SB 3 bet and you say 'of course we are going to 4 bet' implying that we never flat here.
I can understand us perhaps wanting a cold call 3 betting range IP, vs an EP open and CO/ HJ 3 bet as these ranges are very strong and we also have the added benefit of getting to play in position when they may turn their range face up on certain boards post flop. but OOP I can't see many benefits to having this as part of our arsenal.
of course perhaps I am way off and you have a good win rate when doing this.
but yeah, great video and looking forward to the next one!
I usually play shitty games because I like to battle, not smart definetely but now I am creating content online so I hope I can make money other ways to compensate the lack of edge on some tables I play. Anyway by doing this I think I will learn faster and my goal is to become one of the strongest regs regardless of the money.
26 min: What happens is that you cant cold4bet all your range and never call because that will create a leak when he decides to go all in, I will have way too many bluffs. Second we can´t study propertly 3waypots unless we use snowie and this program has call range on this kind of situations. (by the way we are IP against SB, that´s a huge part of the decision, totally OOP I would cold4bet / fold a lot more often.
About the fold on the turn, no problem, I have other hands that can make the call.
Regards!
Fine ;) here it goes. Basicly Mike Sexton was hired to get partypoker of the ground and up and running. Main bases of the site where some place in india. He got theré and like the first thing he needed to do was to help them find a name for the site. (They Only had casinogames at this point in time) and they kinda random had named the site partypoker. When he got there they handed him a list of suggestions of potential names for the site. But he basicly threw the list away and said we keep partypoker cause its sounds fun and is easy to remember ^_^
Thanks ^^ I like the way he chose it, smart thoughts
Nice video again!
About the big 89s hand vs isildur, why did you say you prefer check with J9 , cause maybe it has better blocking capabilitys blocking AJ ?
It´s about not bet-folding too much, equilibrium. J9 has more equity and it´s a waste to bet-fold that hand if you can use other bluff instead.
Regards!
A little humor goes a long way with training vids. I see and appreciate the effort.
If you wouldn't mind, could you please shed a little light on the ranges you have on the slider above your desk? I don't play much online and am just curious what they are and how you use them while playing.
Thanks!
They are just a compilation of ranges preflop I built with Snowie and Pio solver preflop, If I am not sure if I want to play a hand against a particular size I can use them.
Regards!
Really enjoying the videos, Elias. Legit LOL'ed with the spliced in McGregor clips.
:P
Nice Vid sir, the revenge against that T8s guy made me laughing so hard lol
I think he was mad because he came to play against me yesterday and I recorded it for my next Rio video haha
when is the new video coming out?
Hi I have another question for you if that's OK, you seem to advocate betting different sizes with different parts of your range, isn't that much easier for good players to exploit? I would like to know your opinion on choosing the same bet size with your entire range, and why you choose not to do this. Thank you!
Actually I do sizings depending on the texture of the boards, not the hand value, on some boards I have mixed strategies but I always take care of betting with a balanced range
Regards!
nice setup dude!!!
ty Zaza ^^
Hi there!
Are you only use those huds shown on the vid? That's only quite fews!
This is my hud for making videos, pretty basic yes
Sorry it didn’t work out, Elias. I had high hopes for you.
:(
??
i hope this was elias choice 2 leave and not runitonce - if its runitonce choice this is the worst decision ever made by this company.
his videos are the best and most enjoyable on the site, he can even play 5c/10c for all i care and i would prefer watching his content than 60% of the other outdated/boring coaches on this site.
im sorry i had 2 word it that way but its true, there is no enjoyable content on this site anymore & elias content was by far miles above the rest of the coaches.
It´s about a joke I made on the video, I am not leaving guys :P
How many sizing of iso raising you have vs limp SB ? Are you sure that you always raise preflop 4x all the value hands that you have on the river ? Seems that sometimes you are 3.5x.
Totally random between x3.5 and x4 yes :P I am not sure what size is better for Rol from the BB vs SB but I think it must be stronger than x3.
Hey bro, nice video, very entertaining format and clean information. The ideia of using just one screen gives it a great style as you skip the shitty hands. Keep going, count with our support. Regarding ideas from new videos, what do you think to make something in micro limits?
I wouldn´t mind to do that but I am not sure about Rio´s opinion
Very nice video, love your good energy.
Just 1 question. Why do you open 3x on stars and 2x on Party Poker?
Bad hotkeys settings
Please no micro videos..
Noooononoo micro videos. You are by far the best content right now for nlh with Sauce, really hope to keep seeing 5/10+ videos
Hello,
When counting the combos of value and bluffs on the T8 v 98, your assumptions is that you ch flop vs miss cb 100% on AQxcc but having some AQ in your range + the fact he misses cb, i think you should (or Must?) have a prob range flop, what do you think ?
Therefore i would exclude AQ and 66 from your range and maybe as a bluff 87dd or 98dd or JTs ?
obv his call seems disgusting
excellent mcgregor meme lolol
Hi, I'm a little confused because I usually tend to do the opposite about the sizings. I think when I have a stronger range I bet smaller to incentivize calls, but a higher frequency since my range is strong, and when my range is weaker I mix checking and bigger sizing frequencies.
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