$200 Zone Ignition Live Session
Posted by Tyler Forrester
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Hi Tyler,
8:28 with 77 after the flop chk and the small bet on the turn our hand seems transparent and would open us up to a xr alot. Wouldn't we just want to chk back turn and try to get to showdown?
25:00 right table can we xr turn with our combo?
Thanks!
It really isn't that transparent because lots of players do different things with top pair or two pair+. I mean if they put in too much money against 1/3rd pot, then why not check AJ here and the induce 2 big bets.
Definitely an option with 65s on 8733 but I try to be careful with it, because it can get really out of hand on the bluff-side when I don't want to c-r many all my overpairs here. The straight draw without overcards to the 7 is going to be one of lowest EV draw bluffs -- so I generally put it in ranges last.
Nice video tyler!
Loved the phrase i'll float this combo (22, bb vs btn on a high board) because i don't respect his stategy hahaha
I don't play this pool but i expected the passivity postflop although less aggression preflop (maybe a bad distribution-variance)..what do you think about this? at zone 500nl more adequate frequencies overall or some of the same regs?
Thanks man, appreciate the love. At lower stakes I expect players to be more predictable (too loose, too tight) and also to be a little more passive and tend to think players are telling the truth with their bets. The higher stakes players I expect to better at targeting weaker ranges with bluffs and have better hand reading.
7:39 mentioned you want to fire 2 barrels here with A9 (before the XR). I was wondering are you more likely to barrel A9 vs someone who has a calling range in the SB or less likely? Usually SB cold calls makes me not want to barrel them being more fishy.
18:30 I know with AKo solver does a lot of 4betting all in OOP facing a 3bet. Do you ever do this? Or do you mostly just 4bet regular size / flat the 3bet? Also on the 996r board, doesn't look like solver ever uses XRAI, but does use XR (33%) roughly 3x some of the time. Which makes sense because we don't really want TT/JJ to fold right? and you said QQ isn't a good call but they always seem to make it, which I agree with. People just don't fold over pairs. Also in solver land QQ is never folding but JJ starts to fold a tiny bit. Because JJ doesn't 4bet much preflop EP vs MP, I do agree vs 4bet and XR flop, opponent will just end up seeing a lot of AA/KK here and QQ seems a lot better than it actually is. I like your play, but would prefer a club on the board.
The second barrel is probably marginal but the best kings 3-bet pre and the weak ones aren’t often played so the hypothesis is that a marginal ax barrel here would be effective against a random rec.
I don’t really mess around with the allins. It needs computer simulation precision and that’s hard to get in game.
On the check raise it’s probably spewy but balances okay and is hard to play against because it 0 evs jj and QQ.
26:15 when you say with AJs vs small 3bet you're going to have to make a call.... Does this mean you are considering folding it vs a normal 11-12bb 3bet? Typically I would defend something like 99+, A10s+, KJs+ and mix in some 4bet bluffs with A5s/AQo. Thoughts? I noticed a lot of small 3bets OOP and honestly Idk how to play against them. I know the range is only going to be 5-8% vs EP/MP despite the small sizing, but I really don't like folding vs them. Appreciate your thoughts on what range you would defend Ep,MP, CO, BTN vs SB small 3bet given the tight range / small 3bet.
33:30 With K7s CO you mentioned if SB went to 6 or 7 you would fold this, but at 5 you have to call. Isn't his 3bet 7.5 already?
36:00 You mentioned you would play one more orbit and sit out next BB. I am not sure if you ever noticed this, but often times and I mean REALLY OFTEN!!! When I click sit out next BB I tend to get SB 2-3 times, which beats the entire point of playing one last orbit because you pay the same amount of money waiting for the BB to come around. Notice 2 hands later you are SB again with 54h. I don't think I'm too delusional about this either because if I look at my database and I don't play any heads up I have more SB's than any other position.
RunItTw1ce So with AJs here, if they are 3-betting 4% big, it's goign to lose money. You need to have a couple of hands like ATs or KJs in the range which dominate. Since it's smaller stakes game SB vs UTG -- it's likely that lots of players are only 3-betting 4-5%. As the sizings get smaller, you can call more because a Jack and Ace or flush draw (or trips+) is all going to be worth some EV postflop. It's just often not enough to overcome the 10bb loss when miss.
Same story with K7s.
I mean it's possible there's a bug, but I think it's mainly observation bias on the SB before BB idea.
Tyler Forrester so here I looked UTG vs BTN call vs SB squeeze to simulate the 5.7% 3bet range. The 3bet size is obviously larger, but the 3bet range is going to be more accurate. Is this what you were talking about with AJs not being profitable because of the tight range vs UTG? At what size vs this 5.7% 3bet range do we start to call?
RunItTw1ce You'd have to some work here on what sizing to call against 5.7% but truthfully I think that's high here for lots of small-micro players. 5.7% includes basically all suited broadways or AQo and neither region is a guaranteed 3-bet from pool. The basic math is we flop two pair+ about 3.5% of the time so if he 3-bets less than 3.5bb clear call with the extra money from the one pair, flush draw regions. At 5-6bbs he needs to stack most of the time or have other leaks. At 10bbs, he needs to overfold postflop on some node.
Tyler Forrester @ the 2:30 mark you take an exploitive line w/ A8o by 300% lead overbetting river after villain takes a standard 1/3 flop cbet, and turn check line. You stated that the player doesn't have many str8s or flushes here, so you were attacking their imbalance. Is it safe to assume that we should be attacking this line from villain on this runout regardless of blockers and betting the vast majority of range this way? Maybe only checking middle pairs? Therefore, turning all Ax, bottom pairs, and complete air into bluffs regardless of blockers. I guess what I am trying to figure out is how frequently we should be doing this. Wizard prefers having diamond blockers here and never using the 300% sizing. I am also assuming you prefer the 300% sizing to get folds from weak Kx hands. Will 200% or 150% not complete the same goal in your opinion?
So 300% is the DB analysis max value bluff. People are definitely trying to do it as wide as you mention, but there's a key draw back -- if villain switches to an only call strategy then the bluff goes -300% pot negative which is a -22bb mistake or like 500 hands worth of winrate for a typical tag. I use these lines often against weaker competition but am very cognizant of the fact that against better competition we need some reasonable threat of a nut hand before we can do this aggressively.
Tyler Forrester Thank you for the quick response and clarification. I will keep this in mind while experimenting with this line.
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