So as mucha s I think these sorts of hands go down in value as stacks get shorter theres only one reshove stack behind and the table seems pretty soft (its the 215 warmup special edition during wcoop). I think just stealing plenty is going to do pretty well from all positions given how people play.
This is also the ultra deep payouts format where stars is paying 1/4 of the field or whatever so i think some people will play overly tight even to small steals pre etc.
Hi really like your vids!
You say that your $7xx bounty is worth around 30k chips, but is it true given they will only realize half of it and the rest only if they happen to win the entire tour? If so, in super KO where you get 50% of the bin everytime you bust a villain a KO is worth 100% chips you get in the beginning, right?
Okay so in a tourney with a BI of 200$ and a 50% bounty the bounty is worth 100$.
That being said, we only collect 1/2 of it immediately. So if we are playing 10k starting stack then the full bounty of someone is worth 5k chips but when doing the pot math we only add ~2500 because we only get 1/2 immediately. (Actually a little more than 2500 but not by much as we do collect the entire bounty on our self if we win the tourney.
Yea, the full bounty is worth 30k. The actual amount is at least 15k (but not much more).
I'm unsure about this exactly though because i think the way we think about bounties is wrong.
I believe that covering other people adds value to the stack (so like if we have my stack and cover 8/8 people at table then we have a stack value of x, but if we lose half the stack and only cover 4/8 people the value of the stack drops to << x/2).
For that reason losing an all in is more detrimental to us than people think and the simple approximation of converting a bounty$ to chip value and adding them to the pot is not the best approximation. (because if we keep everyone else short we can bust them later).
It seems like there still are two understandings of how much the bounty is worth. First one is what you represent, where full 50% bounty is worth 50% of starting stack (accordingly 25% of the bounty that we can actually win is worth 25% of the starting stack), the second, as explained here by Miikka Anttonen https://www.upswingpoker.com/knockout-bounty-tournaments-progressive-ko/ , says that you buy starting stack for 50% of your BI and the other 50% go to bounty prize pool and as a result are worth the same amount of chips (100% of the starting stack) and when you try to knock out a starting bounty player you should add 50% of starting stack to the pot (as you can win half of the bounty). Can you explain why the other calculation is wrong?
I agree liljis88. If you watch Jeremy menard's video on the $2k scoop or wcoop he would say that you are supposed to go 1/4 so for this example it would be 6250 chips
I think the logic behind what he says is that we have to separate the bounty from the buy in that goes to the prizepool. So if the bounty is 50% of the buy in, logically thinking it is worth 100% of the buy in. For example $600 buy KO in which $300 goes to prizepool and $300 goes to bounty. This means one KO is worth 100% of chips because it is 100% of the buy in that goes to prizepool ($300).
Hey man at 3.30 u call a pretty big bb 3bet with a5dd. Do u think that is standard? And do u think u realize that much equity to call that big 3bet? U need 36% equity to make the call if u realize 100% of that. Your hand has 36% equity against a range like jj+aqo+ value, plus bluffs a2s,a3s 67s,78s..
1.How do u construct his range in that spot in order to make this a call?
2.How much equity do u think u realize in this spot ?
Edit: If u Do u calculate a defend this way(Lefort way), how do u think equity realization changes in 3bet pots? Minimum for equity realization oop he said it was around 62-65. In position around 80%. Do u agree with these assumptions?
Hey, I think that was a little loose. I thought it was a sb 3b I think (in which case it's still loose but I think it's fine). It's too wide vs the BB 3b for sure.
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Hey man,@3:21 whats the main reason of opening 67s with this stack size? Usually i dont open this kind of hands in this depth
Love ur videos, thx
So as mucha s I think these sorts of hands go down in value as stacks get shorter theres only one reshove stack behind and the table seems pretty soft (its the 215 warmup special edition during wcoop). I think just stealing plenty is going to do pretty well from all positions given how people play.
This is also the ultra deep payouts format where stars is paying 1/4 of the field or whatever so i think some people will play overly tight even to small steals pre etc.
Hi really like your vids!
You say that your $7xx bounty is worth around 30k chips, but is it true given they will only realize half of it and the rest only if they happen to win the entire tour? If so, in super KO where you get 50% of the bin everytime you bust a villain a KO is worth 100% chips you get in the beginning, right?
Okay so in a tourney with a BI of 200$ and a 50% bounty the bounty is worth 100$.
That being said, we only collect 1/2 of it immediately. So if we are playing 10k starting stack then the full bounty of someone is worth 5k chips but when doing the pot math we only add ~2500 because we only get 1/2 immediately. (Actually a little more than 2500 but not by much as we do collect the entire bounty on our self if we win the tourney.
So technically your bounty was worth 30k chips, but we when doing the math we should've added only half of it to calculations, right?
Yea, the full bounty is worth 30k. The actual amount is at least 15k (but not much more).
I'm unsure about this exactly though because i think the way we think about bounties is wrong.
I believe that covering other people adds value to the stack (so like if we have my stack and cover 8/8 people at table then we have a stack value of x, but if we lose half the stack and only cover 4/8 people the value of the stack drops to << x/2).
For that reason losing an all in is more detrimental to us than people think and the simple approximation of converting a bounty$ to chip value and adding them to the pot is not the best approximation. (because if we keep everyone else short we can bust them later).
It seems like there still are two understandings of how much the bounty is worth. First one is what you represent, where full 50% bounty is worth 50% of starting stack (accordingly 25% of the bounty that we can actually win is worth 25% of the starting stack), the second, as explained here by Miikka Anttonen https://www.upswingpoker.com/knockout-bounty-tournaments-progressive-ko/ , says that you buy starting stack for 50% of your BI and the other 50% go to bounty prize pool and as a result are worth the same amount of chips (100% of the starting stack) and when you try to knock out a starting bounty player you should add 50% of starting stack to the pot (as you can win half of the bounty). Can you explain why the other calculation is wrong?
I agree liljis88. If you watch Jeremy menard's video on the $2k scoop or wcoop he would say that you are supposed to go 1/4 so for this example it would be 6250 chips
I think the logic behind what he says is that we have to separate the bounty from the buy in that goes to the prizepool. So if the bounty is 50% of the buy in, logically thinking it is worth 100% of the buy in. For example $600 buy KO in which $300 goes to prizepool and $300 goes to bounty. This means one KO is worth 100% of chips because it is 100% of the buy in that goes to prizepool ($300).
Hey man at 3.30 u call a pretty big bb 3bet with a5dd. Do u think that is standard? And do u think u realize that much equity to call that big 3bet? U need 36% equity to make the call if u realize 100% of that. Your hand has 36% equity against a range like jj+aqo+ value, plus bluffs a2s,a3s 67s,78s..
1.How do u construct his range in that spot in order to make this a call?
2.How much equity do u think u realize in this spot ?
Edit: If u Do u calculate a defend this way(Lefort way), how do u think equity realization changes in 3bet pots? Minimum for equity realization oop he said it was around 62-65. In position around 80%. Do u agree with these assumptions?
Hey, I think that was a little loose. I thought it was a sb 3b I think (in which case it's still loose but I think it's fine). It's too wide vs the BB 3b for sure.
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