$215 Big Bounty Hunter Win ft. HeyMonia (part 1)
Posted by Ryan Martin
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It’s funny , but the last hand you showed I instantly put the button on that holding or QT or KT, but my first thought was AT. The reason is pretty clear- board texture , opening /calling ranges and our holding. Even though we won the pot, I agree with Ryan - I prefer to be folding the J8 os. It is just so difficult to beat J9, JT, JQ, KQ, AJ and of course we worry about Qx, Kx, Ax hitting turn/ slash river. Be that as it may, I loved the format with you two talking about the hands and the analysis. My question is whether or not we should be opening up wider given our chip position. I know you didn’t show all the hands , but the hands you opened where all in a class 1, 2 range. If we only open these hands and not some others, we become pretty readable. I’m certain the hand with A7 in the big blind was a squeeze (especially following a min raise) ; any thoughts on this?
Hey, glad you enjoyed the video!
Re: opening wider w/ our big stack early
I'm not super sure about this. It makes sense to me to maybe expand more in EP/MP with hands that can make the nuts like baby pairs and suited Ax/Kx but we're so deep with most people that it's going to be pretty rare that 100bb+ does go in and our reverse implieds do go up w/ the hands we'd want to expand with. I don't think it's a massive concern to just play fairly normal-ish ranges for the most part even after we've doubled. Obviously if we're opening LP into a player or two that's a bit shallower I see some merits to expansion, though.
Re: A7o being a squeeze
I actually think it's a really poor choice for a squeeze and I'd squeeze it 0%. We're too deep. We have a single blocker to their continuing range w/ our A (the 7 is fairly irrelevant) and our hand plays terribly postflop (low playability/dominated by a lot of their Ax calling range vs our squeeze). I'd much prefer to squeeze hands w/ better blockers to their continuing range and better playability i.e. some Axs, suited broadway, KTo+, ATo+, etc. If we feel the need to expand our squeezing range we can just turn up the frequency w/ which we squeeze holdings like this rather than reaching into this weaker Axo region.
Hope that helps!
Very nice and interesting format! Enjoyed it very much! Thank you to both of you for sharing your thinking process.
Love the discourse between you two! Great video as usual and looking forward to the rest of this. Great information on bounty tournaments.
Qd9x could be a bluff/donk at 25:34. What do you think, Ryan?
I definitely need to get in the minds of other player's ranges, as well.
Cheers!
Thanks man! And sorry I took a few days replying to this, totally missed it at the time!
Urgh, I think it's really hard to say without knowing exactly what range BTN probes flop multiway to that sizing with. Without a doubt we have more flushes than they do after defending out of the BB, however, they're definitely not capped on the third diamond turn (can have a bunch of Axdd/Kxdd/Qxxdd, themselves). In theory, Qd9x or even the hand we have are probably two of the weaker holdings we call flop with (with two live ranges still to act and facing that sized probe) so it's possibleeee we actually use these hands as 'bluffs' on the turn a decent amount of the time on a low diamond? Obviously I'd lean towards bluffing the Qd9x more than this hand since I think the Jx8d still has some SDV (as seen here), but yeah, I'd be okay w/ donking some % of the time I think.
With that said...entirely possible it isn't a thing w/ how strong ranges should be in this spot getting to river (even if perhaps in practice they are a bit wider than that)
The first hand with QQ, why are we worried about sizing for our range? This is the first hand of the tournament and many of the players are randoms. How are they going to figure out what we have by our sizing? It would be kind of a disaster with QQ if you made it 14K and everyone folded.
I'm always going to start from the baseline of what does my range want to do in this spot and then work towards what I think are reasonable exploits w/ my hand vs their ranges/based on their tendencies.
I can be convinced 3b'ing smaller with Aces and maybe KK is fine/maximizes EV but I'm definitely not convinced smaller is best w/ QQ. I think we definitely want to at least get this hand postflop HU as it's not going to appealing to go multiway w/ an SPR of 2 w/ a hand that's vulnerable to an A or K flopping (which will happen a little less than half the time). Worst case I pick up 7.5bb uncontested and now I cover everyone at the table - not the worst result w/ this hand, especially in a PKO. So yeah, I think it's definitely a stretch to think us making it 14k and having everyone fold is 'kind of a disaster'. I think you're probably overestimating the EV of our hand in this spot.
No problem, my man!!! You're golden.
senterpied99 should be paul senter right? ex RIO coach think you are right ryan
10:30:
You make a mistake with the math of the PKO here. The initial bounty is worth half the stack, not 25% (actually even a bit more if you factor in the rare case in which you happen to win the tournament).
See also this video and thread for further discussion:
https://www.runitonce.com/poker-training/videos/comparing-ranges-freezeout-vs-pko/
Pretty sure it's he, not I, that am getting this incorrect. He's reviewing a $500 + $500 + $50 ($1050) PKO MTT. He's paying $1000 for 100k chips starting stack (not $500 as he suggested in the thread). If you bust someone, you'll win $250 (half of the bounty on each player's head that is displayed on Party Poker) or 1/4 of the buy-in for the tournament.
0.25*100k = 25k
Following up on this, talked to a couple of people...doesn't seem people have agreed on which of the math is 'correct'...apparently a couple of RIO guys think starting bounty = 50% SS in value...bencb suggests it's somewhere in the range of 30-35%...and I was taught by someone who was taught by the creator of one of those KO calculators that it's = to 25% SS
You are making a mistake in logic here. In a 1050$ PKO you are paying 500$ for 100k starting chips. You cannot count in the rake and the other 500$ that you pay for the bounty as they are taken out of the regular prizepool.
Just take the example of a Super KO. It is widely agreed upon that a bounty is worth one starting stack in chips, so it is just logical that in a PKO it equals to 50%.
I am guessing a bounty is worth 33%. My thinking is that in a $100 tournament, only $75 dollars is up for grabs in the prize pool, $50 in standard prizes and $25 if you win the whole thing as you collect your own bounty, so $75 dollars is up for grabs, the other $25 dollars disappears to players pocketing half the bounties on every knock out. So 75% of the buyin goed on the prize pool and 25% is taken out by players winning bounties. A bounty is worth $25 dollars, so it is worth a third($25 of $75)of the initial stack which is 33000 chips in the case of this tournament.
In the J TP Hand... just dont go broke deep in a Tour OOP with a sh... TP
we have a 8 Kicker and if he bets again i am done..
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