Mid/High Stake 6-Max PLO Analysis
Posted by André Santos
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Excellent video! I have a question about your "My Strategy" slide @
21:00. How frequently do you check turn, check raise river with a
nut/strong flush; this would be a large adjustment in my strategy to
counteract a frequent and large bet size otr. The downside is that if we
start checking some strong flushes then it will meddle with our
barreling range, and force us to barrel less with bluffs if we want to
be balanced. How do you view this trade off?
If we barreled all strong flushes ott and were to never CR river (even with med flushes for arguments sake), then the equilibrium on the river would involve villain betting pot and very frequently as you modelled. But by barreling we gain either value or fold equity ott with our strong flushes and air respectively, and can do so more frequently if we choose to not have a river CR range.
But checking turn sometimes with strong flushes protects our turn check range, as well as river range, and now the optimal bet size for villain is not clear at all if he is faced with a threat of getting CRed, whereas it was clearly pot in your example. So we force villain to lose some ev on the turn and river.
What we really gain from having a strong flush in our river range sometimes, is that villain cannot freely bet large, as we beat both his value bets and bluffs, and forcing him to bet smaller means he must give up a lot of his bluffs. I think this is definitely worth passing up some turn barrel EV for, as we now retain/realise more river equity.
Also a slight nitpick on the same slide. Point number 2 says villain can exploit us by making a smaller bet size if we're over-folding. However this assumes our river calling frequency is inelastic, as we are only over-folding vs a PSB. But actually our strategy is not defined against another bet size, so it is not quite true to say that it exploits us, although I do agree with the sentiment since we are likely over-folding vs most bet sizes if we do so against one.
Hi Gameking,
Thank you for your feedback and input.
About your first question: I think having flushes on both 2-b and checking range is very important (however I'd be inclined to include most "big" flushes on 2-b range and most small on checking range, and I'll try to explain you why).
This is a spot where I want to have a semi-wide bluffing range on turn because I know that villain probably jams with all nut FD's on flop and most 2nd nut FD's on turn which makes his range kind of capped. The fact that is range is (mostly) capped is really important because it allows me play "perfectly" and in a way that no matter what he does I win a bigger share of the pot than the equity of my hands would indicate (this is kind of tough to explain, but happens everytime one player has a capped range and the other plays near-GTO, and is even more relevant when there are more streets to play and with a bigger SPR)
And this is just a consequence of a likely misbalance of villain's range. He could easily solve this "problem" by calling with some nut/2nd FD's on flop, so that his range wouldn't be capped on flush turns.
But, on the other hand, and as you mentioned I don't want to be x/f everytime i check turn to him. But since I think is range is (mostly) capped I can acomplish this by checking sometimes with Q/J high or lower flushes. With little more than 1psb to play with I don't think I need much a x/r range (I would if SPR was bigger). If his small bet size on the river has more bluffs than it should have as I think it does, I can easily counter it by over-calling with bluff catchers. And if it doesn't I could use my Qh flushes and then some of my bluffs (mostly high spades blockers) to x/r.
About your last paragraph, I think you're absolutely right and I should have mentioned that on my slide. But as you said, I just assumed (wrongly) that if we're over-folding against pot, we'll be over-folding against a smaller bet-size as well.
André
Just not a very good video, sorry. Hard to follow when you don't show replays of the hands, but instead talk them through.
In the first hand analysis you said: if our equity is 52% against villain's range, we have an +EV against him. How so? (Or did it mean that we beat 52% of his combos and he is always calling? Didn't really understand what you were aiming to.)
Hi,
Thank you for your feeback.
I re-watched the whole video to try to understand why you had trouble following the action. I think I made an okay job of explaining the action on most hands (I tell positions, previous action, future action, starting stacks in all hands if I'm not wrong).
However I can understand that at some points the video can get a little bit confusing. E.g. on the 2nd last slide, when I'm talking about a range that I built for the villain, I'm talking most of the time as if this was my own range and not his. As I'm trying to analyze the hand from both prespectives I got a bit carried away and forgot that I was actually the SB and not the UTG in the actual hand.
I will be more careful on future videos about this, so that it's easier to follow for everyone.
André
Nice video Andre. The program you're using to run ev calculations is omaha ranger correct? Would you say it's worth the 1900$ price, and how much more useful then odds oracle is it?
Hi Majin,
Thank you for your feedback.
Yes, the program I've been using on my last videos is Omaha Ranger.
I think the program is very good, and I was actually introduced to it after my 2nd video by a RIO subscriber, that thought it would save me a lot of time/trouble compared to PPT/odds oracle.
Its main advantage it that the syntax is much easier as it allows you to write ranges by hand strenght on various streets instead of only pre-flop hand combos (e.g. on JT9 I can write set> for set or better, instead of 87,Q8,KQ,JJ,TT,99). This not only saves time but most importantly sims will much more accurate when you use good pre-flop ranges (open, 3b, 4b,call 3b,etc), because you don't have to be guessing anymore how many combos of KQ you have compared to JJ for example.
I haven't rly used odds oracle a lot (since I mostly used to run sims on PPT), so I don't feel qualified to compare one to the other.
About whether is worth the $1900 I think it's debatable and super dependent on your situation. I would probably start consider buying it if it represented 5% or less of my BR and if I was serious about improving my PLO game.
If I'm not mistaken you can get a trial for 30 days.
André
This is absolutely incredible stuff André! I'll have to go over it again to absorb it. It's clear that you've put a lot of time and work into this video.
Hi jonna,
Thanks for the compliment. Yes, it did take me many hours to do this video (and most of my other videos fwiw). In the end is always worth it, since at least some people find them useful and I always learn something new as well while making them.
André
Hi guys, thanks for the feedback.
I'm a bit busy this week but will get back to you as soon as possible.
this was good, like that you went into sufficient detail but still managed to get 5 hands in
Hi phil,
Thank you. That was exactly my point (try to explain everything that I found relatively important on each hand, but not lose too much time on basic/not so relevant stuff, so that I could fit a few interesting hands), so I'm glad that worked out.
André
nice vid again Andre. can you share the excel formulas for the AKJ7 HH when you're calculating MW ev? (at 11:00 or so into the video on the slide titled "E.V." thanks!
Hi grape,
Thank you. Send me your e-mail via pm and I'll e-mail you my sheet.
André
Hi,
When I fullscreen this video, everything is shifted slightly to the right, cutting out about 1/4th of the screen... Other videos working fine, using HTML5 player... Any idea whats wrong?
Love your videos btw.
Hi Tian,
Thanks for the feedback. Someone from RIO's tech department will take a look into that.
André
great!
I do not know the programm, that you used. Tell please, what is it?
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