Becoming a Boss: Bluffcatching and Bluffraising
Posted by Luke Johnson
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Mr Woozy Awesome man, tyvm :)
Hope you enjoyed
1) I would classify the GTFO category as bluff catching ace high, where people turn 44-22 into bluffs.
2) 7 min bluff raising - when you discuss blockers / unblockers. I think there is a big difference in six max vs HU games as you play both, so will know more than me about this. Nuno tried to explain it to me where I grasp some of it, but still far away from fully grasping the concept and details. In six max where ranges are more narrow blockers are preferred, where in HU where ranges are wider, having unblockers to the (call-call-fold) range is more preferred.
3) For value raising - How do you determine when it is a good value raise? Because solver will call a lot of top pairs or even 2nd pair with a flush blocker, but in the games you often hear people say people don't bluff raise the river, so they end up over folding. On one hand you are raising for value because solver shows you should range vs range, but in the other hand opponents seem to over fold and only call better.
4) 16:30 with AK (no diamond) on the turn QQ2r-7dd you show how PIO wants to fold with a diamond blocking the bluffs, but on the notes river you want a diamond in your hand blocking his give ups. How do we balance this? Also it did look like PIO is calling with ATd over AK? The back door diamonds that we float that usually call-call-fold are actually call-call-call? At least the stronger ace high diamonds? Then off suite AK type hands we call twice and hope we improve or hope river goes XX?
RunItTw1ce
1).
I don't like this; there's plenty of SRP spots where you need to call lower than Ahi, in both HU and 6max
2).
How wide or tight a range is should not affect the blocker/unblocker effects (only indirectly at best) - what matters is the bet/raise size. And as far as I can tell, the difference is mostly on flop/turn (more consistent user of small sizes HU). I haven't noticed much of a difference OTR between the formats. If there is, I would hope/expect it to be fairly subtle.
3).
I try to follow the solver!
4).
IMO, our balancing act shouldn't be thought about within a small subset like the "range of diamonds".
We call the diamonds that are XXdd, not single diamonds unpaired hands
Thanks for the comment and questions. Keep them coming!
34:30 on the 964ccc-Tx-Qc board mentioned bluff raising some with 4x hands. What about bluff raising with straight blockers T7s, J7s, T8o, T7o? If villain is bet folding some 2 pairs QT & Q9, is he bet calling with straights? Having blockers to the straight would make sense as a bluff, right?
1hr 10min on the QT72K board on the river where AT and J10 are raising 25-30% of the time, would you simplify this to always call AT and always bluff J10 or still try and match PIO frequency? Or I guess you can always call AT & JT and always bluff J4s?
You wanted to know if you are doing a good job or bad job at the end of the video, I don't think you are doing a good job. I think you are doing a GREAT JOB! 100% elite level content. Some of the best on the site.
RunItTw1ce
1).
You want to block the bet-calls, not just the bets. Whether or not villain bet-folded a vbet or a bluff is not relevant, what matters is that he folded.
2).
How can I simplify this without knowing the answer in the first place? Similar to my other comment, I don't believe our balancing act should be looked at within small subsets like this
Thank you very, very much for the kind words. Hearing feedback like that is extremely motivating!
Lol, nice pic. I know the feeling xD
Luke Johnson this is the spot of the range I was talking about besides using 4x as bluffs for unblockers, it does look like some blockers to straights are bluffing.
In six max I used BU vs BB for 2.5x size preflop, 27% turn probe, and 24% river probe. In your hand it was 1/3 turn & river, so it will be slightly off in terms of pot size and of course ranges are vastly different as well. Can see in the screen shot below it is only the Tc8x or Tx8c that is raising the river.
Appears to be a large portion of A6o, A4o, A9o, 65s, 54s and T9o hands no club are bluff raising this river for six max. I can see why A6o and A4o can unblock the bluffing range, I am not sure why two pair is bluff raising in six max.
1).
Those straight blockers are only value raises with 1 club
Again, remember that you want to block the bet-calls, not just the bets. This is extremely important. Straights are close to the bottom of villain's vbet range with no relevant blockers, so they often bet-fold. Therefore, we do not want to block straights when bluffing.
2).
Could not tell you without having the sim in front of me, sorry. I would suspect if it because of the unblocking nature (we cannot have blockers here). But really, I'd need to have the sim up in front of me.
22 minute K2 situation(no in the range) lol super standard :D
Oh that was a deep video, need time to absorb it and revisit later. I think knowledge coming from knowing exactly(at good base) what your opponent strategy looks like (GTO). When you understand whats villian range value/bluffs and what hands he has at this node it is not that hard to make bluffcatch based on quality of your hand (unblocking bluffs). For example if you drill 1 000 hands (Axx situation) you will exactly know every node of equiliubruim and that 22 call on A43d J7 board would be automatic pretty much (not convinced it would be winning though at low stakes, lol, who knows however)
Jeff_
Haha lol. I was pissed at myself in the moment hahaha
Yes, this video was pretty long and deep in the lab (and maybe a little long-winded!)! I hope the audience finds this interesting and viewable for the extended period. Watching in parts probably would work nicely, I know that my attention span wouldn't manage the single viewing.
Yep, garnering the knowledge to get better and better and better is what it's all about!
Try not to worry about it maybe winning or losing or breaking even, it doesn't matter in the bigger picture. And besides, if you work hard, you won't be playing there anymore anyway! (Y)
Hi, Luke, great vid, thanks.
T9 hand
I wonder why we choose 4x hands as a preferable bluff raise?
Solver raises them all day.
Villain has tiny amount of bet-calls with 64, 94, T4.
So it seems blocking the calling range is not a case with 4x.
Maybe we want to block a 3 bet range, which has a 44 with a 50% frequency?
Or maybe we want to unblock bet-folding bluff range so we want to have 2x-5x in our hand (42, 43, 53 etc suits well and 92 93 even better cause we block both bet-call and unblock bet-fold range)
Would love to hear your thoughts.
sharfeek
I believe it is because the 4x does the best job of unblocking the 2p which fold the majority of the time vs the raise.
In this hand, blockers are not possible, as blockers are flushes, and flushes are not bluffs. Therefore, we want to maximise our unblockers instead. 4x does a fantastic job of this!
Note that this is all 20/20 hindsight. There's no chance I manage to find this all in game lol
It seems blockers can be the case here if we use small raise size. Cause it forces villain to call wider.
Actually solver uses 2 raise sizes here. The smaller one (8bb raise after 2bb bet, with 15% frequency) and bigger one (16bb, 8% freq).
After 8bb raise villain has to call a bunch of not club hands with like 25-50% frequency, such hands as KJo, KTo, QTo, J7o, T8o, T7o, 98o, 97o, and some suited ones ss/hh/dd.
As for bigger size it's not a case, yeah.
Yes that absolutely makes sense, but.... I'm not even going to try and begin to mix my raise sizes here OTR on 4flush runouts :D
In all seriousness, your point is absolutely valid, but just a bit too impractical for human application IMO
I don’t always watch super long poker theory videos, but when I do i prefer Luke Johnson’s videos
nogamblenofuture
<3
Love to hear it mate, thank you very much!
Really hope I did not disappoint!
really nice video thx for making it
MMA_Sherpup
I see what you've done with your name there...
You're welcome!
Absolutely incredible video. Thoroughly enjoyed every minute.
Would love to see a liveplay video in the future.
Cheers!
Thank you so much Tariq Haji ! So glad to hear you enjoyed every minute :)
My next video will be a liveplay. Stay tuned (Y)
Really excellent video Luke. This is the first month I've had an elite membership and your two videos alone have given me more than enough to think about for it to have been worth it!
Cheers Joe O'Donnell !!
Really hope you enjoyed them mate (Y)
Great video mate, really nice addition to your first
Thank you Brian Riera !
First two were rather heavy in the lab... next one will hopefully be a bit more chilled with some live play :)
GG man! Excellent spots chosen, thanks!
Could be interesting to see Value raise rivers, with some capped boards, to see which kind of hands to tricky it
cheers
Thank you fentguita !
What do you mean by capped boards? As in, when we are capped?
Hey Luke,
I just wanted to underline all the other comments: Your vids are awesome! Really great and in depth stuff, love it.
Cheers
Hey Horkitorki14
Thank you so much. Really happy to hear you enjoy the in-depth dives!
Lots more to come:)
A+ vid again, well done! Loved the blockers/unblockers talk. You're presenting the theory in a way that makes it quite easy for the viewer to grasp it, which is a v hard feat.
Thanks a lot bro. My presenting methods still have a ways to go, but I'm working on it :)
Really high value content and great presentation. Much appreciated!
Sam Grafton Thank you so much for watching Sam! Glad you enjoyed :)
gtfo lol- was playing live a couple weeks ago and called a river allin donk with ahigh and said out loud, "get the fuck outta here" bc he rivered a 3 with his missed draw
Hahaha lmao :(
*Disclaimer: may not apply to live settings vs donk shoves xD
LOL jazzyspazz That is hilarious! I remember calling certain spots like this live where I called ATs and got owned by AJ high. Feels good to be right but lose money some times LOL At least they won't try and bluff you as much in the future.
Absolutely brilliant video. I dont think I have ever enjoyed watching really deep theory videos so much. Which is a good job as I will have to watch three times to start to grasp it.
Is this how you would study a spot in general? Skip over the flop / turn play and make some pre solver assumptions and then check yourself? Or is it just for the sake of this specific concept in the video?
Thank you very much CatorMan :)
Haha, I hope the rewatches aren't too long-winded for you.
Yes, the main consistency with my studying is that I will always do my workings before seeing the solution!
Not at all. Gotcha I do think that is great advice and something I will look to make a habit.
Loving these style of videos.
Thank you I_Fold_Jacks
Theses videos are the nuts , really enjoy it and show a great way to work on your game, love it.
Thanks Luke
Awesome FlexinGreenT
Glad you are finding good value from them mate. More to come!
Amazing Video! Solver output makes so much more sense after watching the two parts of Becoming a Boss. Would love to watch more videos like these.
Cheers!
Everything making a bit more sense is a great feeling tbag (Y)
Cheers to you, too!
great stuff. re: bluff catching being mandatory if we beat value; what if we're playing with a bad/passive player who massively under bluffs, and we only beat 1 combo of value? What if we assume villain never bluffs and we only beat 1 combo of value and it's a large bet? In these extreme situations does the heuristic still hold up?
Theory will be out of whack if you look at it through an exploitative lens. This does not imply it necessarily changes your action every time, though.
As for what you should do: I'm sorry, but the ball is in your court; I don't feel comfortable giving advice on how you should go about approaching villains X, Y and Z, as that may get you into more harm than good.
radtupperware
How'd that go? Did you get the folds?
Just remember: it's not spew, if it gets through.
Awesome video, I love the idea of writing down all of your thoughts before taking a look at the answer. Going straight to Pio would be like just reading a math problem and instantly looking at the back of the book.
Very didatic format, keep it up!
Max Lacerda Yep that analogy is perfect, nice :)
It can become a little tedious at times, but without a doubt worth it!
Hey Luke,
Great content, yet again.
My question is when when the term 'unblocker' is used, is it referring to villain's river folds? For example the A2 combos in hand 1. 2 serves as a blocker (3 barrel value and river continue) and an unblocker, is the unblocker part referring to villain's river folding range to our bluff raise?
Thanks.
Hey bubupoker
Sorry for the late reply, I have only just saw this comment!
Unblocker can serve to any range, whether that's folding or calling.
E.G.
We want our value to unblock calls, so that we get called more.
We want our bluffs to unblock folds, so that we get called less.
Hello Luke,
When deciding how do you decide between bluffcatching and bluffraising? The properties that make a bluffraise will also make it a good bluffcatch, so how do you differentiate between them?
Hello dayung !
Firstly, bluffcatching requires SDV, whereas bluffcatching does not. Therefore, we should look to organise accordingly.
Secondly, bluffcatchers require blockers to villain's value range, however, bluffraises requires blockers to villain's continue range (STRONG value that can not only vale bet, but can also continue vs a raise).
As a heuristic, the most premium bluffcatchers usually do well as bluffraises, too. However, this isn't always the case.
Great video, however, the random F-bomb dropped here and there in your videos seems out of place and degrades it in my opinion, which causes a loss in creditability.
Hey LiveCashGuy
Sorry that you feel this way. It's been a while since I made this video, so I forget where the F-bombs present themselves, but I do understand your point. However, I disagree with your opinion on lack of credibility; if what I'm saying makes sense, then an occasional F-bomb, whilst perhaps out of place, should not result in any misinformation, etc. Moreover, I believe my video is still very credible and useful to viewers.
Hey Luke,
I believe you make some of the best videos on the site, and some of the best I've seen including other coaching sites as well. My only critique was really the seemingly out of place (from your friendly demeanor) /out of character words that took me by surprise. This is of course only my opinion, and as a man of Faith/Christian, I felt the need to point it out. Otherwise, keep up the great work, I look forward to more of your videos.
Hey LiveCashGuy
I agree that they are out of place. I believe I have done a better job in more recent videos.
I will do! Thank you very much :)
Great video luke thanks man!
Thanks mate :)
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