3 Tables $500 Zoom NLHE Live Session

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3 Tables $500 Zoom NLHE Live Session

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Lucas Greenwood

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3 Tables $500 Zoom NLHE Live Session

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Lucas Greenwood

POSTED Jul 15, 2013

Freshly back from the WSOP, Lucas dives back in to the online games with a 3 table session and shares his thoughts on the inner strength required to fold.

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themightyjim 11 years, 8 months ago

this is probably the first NL video I've watched on the site, but it was pretty disappointing.  Lucas, do you feel that you played well in this session?  You were clearly running poorly in terms of hitting flops, and turning cards to barrel both as bluffs and to pick up equity.  but you were also x/c'ing tons of weak made hands OOP with little to know plan for what you were going to do on blank turns when facing a barrel.  seems to me that you either need to be a little tighter pre or on the flop, or be turning some hands into bluffs.

 

would like to hear your thoughts on your play this session.

Lucas Greenwood 11 years, 8 months ago

I'm upset that you feel that way, I do have a tendency to play too many hands, and as I mention about 36 mins I was playing too passively pf. I'd point out that oop I tend to c/c a lot of hands including most of my nutted combos meaning I can get away with loose peels, planning on turning them into bluffs on rivers or realizing my equity by getting good cards. That said its probably something I need to work on, because I probably do it too light both pf and on the flop, especially out of the bb. If you can cite any specific examples I'd be happy to give my thoughts.

themightyjim 11 years, 7 months ago

not sure if this will read as a reply to Lucas's reply, but that's what I'm trying to do ;)

I've since watched a couple more of your videos, including the 3betting Linear vs Polarized (a concept which I'm very familiar with) and I thought you did an excellent job of clearly explaining and breaking down the concept.  It was a nice chance to re-learn the theory and practice behind constructing 3betting ranges against various opponents, and reminded me to look at my own notes on the subject.  Very good stuff.

did you play a lot of live poker this summer in Vegas?  If so I would wonder if the parts of your play that I was critical in this video are symptomatic of expecting differing actions with different range construction from your average villain.  In general I thought your analysis in the video was good, but your decisions on the likelihood that some weak hands could be profitably played OOP by calling I disagreed with.  I'd need to rewatch to give specific examples.  I wonder if a summer of facing super imbalanced often passive opponents caused you to slightly alter your ranges for x/c'ing and bluff catching.  FWIW I don't often find myself turning decent SD value into bluffs live, but it is something that has always been a fairly important part of my online game. 

anyway, appreciate you taking the time to reply, and thanks for your honest thoughts.

Daryl Kelly 11 years, 8 months ago

at 27.48 aq i think your fold on the river is bad you are giving op way to much to much credit and if you are calling the turn to fold any river is burning money, any thoughts?

Lucas Greenwood 11 years, 8 months ago

I was calling every river except a spade, I don't think villain will vbet aj and at twice.  Meaning I only beat air that floated the flop or a medium pair bluffing.  I did take a weak line and may have incorrectly folded a chop but this specific player doesn't float flops often enough for me to be comfortable calling a spade 

Daryl Kelly 11 years, 8 months ago

fair enough. i think your reasoning is good but on the other hand you can have many flushes in your range far more than him since you didnt 3bet from the sb, you can have allot of suited high broadway cards and allot of random connecting cards you think are profitable to call with, although thinking about it you dont have any high spade blockers  in you're hand which sucks more, for example if you had aq with a of spades would you be calling?

Lucas Greenwood 11 years, 8 months ago

I opened utg so I expect he can flat AK PF, and I expect him to vbet it as well, He can also have sets and suited wheel aces some % of the time. Although my hand is kind of face up, I have a lot of Ax hands for raising utg so I don't expect to get floated super wide, although my turn range doesn't contain many fds (making his river bluff good with any weak hands he has) I don't expect him to arrive at the river with many hands worse than AQ that he opts to bet turn and river with i.e. if he had JJ he'd probably check back turn and if he had AJ he'd probably check back river so I'm happy with the fold.

ItsToothPasteISwear 11 years, 8 months ago

Hey Lucas, I enjoyed the vid.

Question about the 98s hand there at the end. If we think his most likely range for leading the flop is flush draws and sets, is barreling turn and river really going to profitable once he checks to us. I dont think its a bad spot to check his nut hands now that he hits, since its going to be hard for you to call, so I dont think it excludes his flushes cuz he checks. But even if we think he doesnt have a flush, and  I agree with your thoughts on the size of the river bet that its good size for value, but at the same time, if we are trying to get him to fold a set, we are going to have to bet bigger, cuz hes just always going to tank/call to that size cuz he has a set. So we basicaly are never getting anything to fold as really he either has a club or a set once he gets to to the river here. thoughts?


Lucas Greenwood 11 years, 8 months ago

I think I made the turn bet because my thinking in game was, why should I call flop if I'm not going to bet this turn.  Of course that's a flawed thought, I should only bet turn if I think it's a good bet,  I. E.  He's going to fold a hand better than mine often ..  I would prefer a flop fold, because it's 3 ways and I only have 6 clean outs.  Once he checks turn I think checking is the best play, all I fold out is jx without a club which he probably doesn't  lead otf.  River bet is still good Imo he nearly folded his hand and there are plenty of combos of flushes in my range. 

colosk1 11 years, 8 months ago

26:40 AK, you say 4 bet calling is the best play and you mention the possibility he could be bluffing. Do you really think he has anything other than a non value hand here? The original PFR still has to act and could jam overtop which would mean that villain  has put in over 1/3 of his effective stack vs the Shorty.


In this spot when someone cold 4 bets after you have 3 bet a short stack, isn't it always value when the SS can still come over the top? I still agree that 5-bet calling is the best play but how can you think he can possibly be bluffing here with the SS still to act?

Lucas Greenwood 11 years, 8 months ago

The shortstack opened the CO for a min raise, he can have quite a wide range to open, and likely will fold 80% of the time or so to the 4bet. Its also a perfectly good spot for me to 3bet bluff, meaning the BB can cold 4bet some hands as bluffs, but plan on calling the shorties shove, i.e. medium PPs, ATs, AJs. Once its back to me I could call but I chose to 4bet because I want to realize all my equity, i.e. not have to fold chops or the best hand on bad boards, although its def possible that calling has a higher EV.


colosk1 11 years, 8 months ago

I think you misread my question, I play AK exactly the same as you. My question wasn't if 3 betting or calling the 4 bet  was the correct play but rather your thoughts on the fact that villain "definitely could be bluffing here" (That's what you said in the video)

I thought the fact that you thought the villain could be bluffing in that spot is unrealistic. Villain cold 4 bets to 35% of the cutoffs stack and if cutoff shoves and you fold with the dead money in the pot from your 3 bet  he has to call with any 2.  The fact that he opened himself up to the possibility of playing for stacks vs the cutoff and never being able to fold basically eliminates the possibility of this being a bluff, don't you think? If not I'd like to know your thoughts on why Villain can be 4 bet bluffing here and see the math behind why a 4 bet bluff is profitable here when he is forced to call with any 2 if cutoff jams and you fold.


Lucas Greenwood 11 years, 8 months ago

"Its also a perfectly good spot for me to 3bet bluff, meaning the BB can cold 4bet some hands as bluffs, but plan on calling the shorties shove, i.e. medium PPs, ATs, AJs"

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