Great video as usual. I would like to see more references to the player pool tendencies aka exploits, pretty much like you spotted a couple of time in this video. It's always good to visualize PIO strat. being mixed with pool tendencies to have a fair and solid guideline and maximize our EV, since some strats are going to deviate because population is overdoing stuff or vice versa.
Hi, nice video. Definitely will rematch it again in few weeks to learn better.
When you were talking about 422rainbow board you mentioned that it is similar to something like 732rainbow ( I don't remember time and it is not important), I believe 732r is better for IP and he should have EV advantage (maybe ~0,2-0,7BB) having some 33 and 22 and pairs in his range. While in 422 he pretty much have 0 nuts and let OOP player put pressure on him resulting in losing EV.
Great video Mark! Agree to the first comment - I loved the mixture of GTO breakdown interfered with the different nodelocked pool tendencies. Also your range charts are awesome. I felt like they helped me understand PIO better throughout the whole video.
Just a general question toward this magnificent video. Which postions do we assume each player is in the pio analysis.And is it only apply to online 6-max game?
It's a ep/ mp range vs button cold calling range. It's mainly for 6 max but i can be applied to other sized tables as well. Ranges would be a bit different but the ideas stay the same.
I am not aware of solvers that help you analyzing multiway spots. This might be an interesting idea for a video where i try to explain my thoughtprocess on multiway flops.
Hey thanks for the video elusive!! I know you make elite content, but is there any chance that you can maybe make one or two video's on how to crush the lower stakes, just for diversity xD
I'm trying to wrap my head around the fact that PIO suggests ranges where combos are in fractions. To me this is highly impractical but more importantly it obscures meaningful insights. I think PIO needs to be used in a certain way that is more reflective of actual in-game dynamics. for example, preflop mixing of hands can be either done in fractions of .25, .5. or .75. That is to say I can expect a certain player to 3bet AQs 50% of time. Assigning it 33% or any other fraction doesnt make practical sense. How can a player even manage to keep track of which hands he has 3bet what percent of the time and from which position.
Coming to flop, PIO recommending raising 5.9 combos is all good but no player is doing that. wouldn't it better to a) assign post flop actions based on flop texture and range advantage? if the OOP shouldnt have a check raising range then dont set it as option in PIO. This will obviosuly affect the combos that can be bluffed raised
b) i think post flop actions need to be rounded to the nearest .5 or .25. any other fraction is meaningless. not because no player would ever be able to play in those fractions but mainly cause it obscures insight from PIO. this would help us under stand how to play certain types of draws.
PIO plays perfectly vs PIO. So both inputs try to maximum exploit each other which comes to an equilibrium.
We don't play vs PIO so betting the right combos x% of the time is impractical and impossible to execute.
When we understand why a solver takes certain lines and we see our opponents take different lines we can try to exploit that. Vs good regs this can be subtle changes by betting slightly more or less with specific draws, valuebets, bluffs etc. VS weaker opponents this can be totally different and we can change direction completely.
RNG can help with the " i want to 3bet this combo x% of the time" .
Maybe but i am not sure. Phil and i believe Sauce had some videos (or at least mentioned it) had some videos about how to adjust at lower stakes."
Oh ok ill check them out, i just really like watching your video's :-) , and would love to see one on how to crush lower by you :-) But some of the time your videos are just over my head, im just a microstraker, so maybe im missapplying some stuff im thinking.
I used this site: https://www.grafiektool.nl/
But this one is in Dutch. I am sure just googling it that u can find a bunch of sites where u can make diagrams and similair things.
Wicked video Mark. very informative spotted a few leaks in my game already, any chance you can do the same for BTN vs BB where the ranges are wider? Thanks again keep up the good work.Good luck at the tables.
hi Mark, your exploit vs a OOP 100% c-bet on most neutral / better for IP boards was to raise IP more often, which I totally agree with and is useful since most players in my live pool c-bet way too high on almost any boards and never check/raise as PFA (unless with sets). Tough we often lack credibility when we do it, they still can't defend enough anyway
however when I was running sims (with more loose range for the opener like HJ/CO or vs BU cc), to my surprise, on some board like J43r, the exploit was not to raise IP more often but to call with 100% range (the problem is when we call 100% and they keep barreling on turn, our IP continuing range is so weak)
how can you explain that on some boards the raise frequency stays the same vs over c-bet and the right PIO strategy is to mostly call and not raise? how do you then proceed on later streets ? Thanks!
I'm interested to see the aggregation reports. Is there anything meaningful we can find? Is 50 boards enough for something like this, or would there be too much sampling bias?
Loading 22 Comments...
Great video as usual. I would like to see more references to the player pool tendencies aka exploits, pretty much like you spotted a couple of time in this video. It's always good to visualize PIO strat. being mixed with pool tendencies to have a fair and solid guideline and maximize our EV, since some strats are going to deviate because population is overdoing stuff or vice versa.
Hi, nice video. Definitely will rematch it again in few weeks to learn better.
When you were talking about 422rainbow board you mentioned that it is similar to something like 732rainbow ( I don't remember time and it is not important), I believe 732r is better for IP and he should have EV advantage (maybe ~0,2-0,7BB) having some 33 and 22 and pairs in his range. While in 422 he pretty much have 0 nuts and let OOP player put pressure on him resulting in losing EV.
Thanks!
Yes 723rb is better for IP than 422rb. Then i probably misspoke.
Great video Mark! Agree to the first comment - I loved the mixture of GTO breakdown interfered with the different nodelocked pool tendencies. Also your range charts are awesome. I felt like they helped me understand PIO better throughout the whole video.
hi elusivemark,
Just a general question toward this magnificent video. Which postions do we assume each player is in the pio analysis.And is it only apply to online 6-max game?Thank you polarizing53,
It's a ep/ mp range vs button cold calling range. It's mainly for 6 max but i can be applied to other sized tables as well. Ranges would be a bit different but the ideas stay the same.
Love the pio sims, they are very helpful.
Awesome video! Would love to see more of this stuff where you pick out some other preflop spots and look at diff boards like this.
Will do some similair videos in the future for different types of spots
Is there any good way yet of analysing multiway spots? For example exactly the same ranges but add the big blind cold calling as well.
I am not aware of solvers that help you analyzing multiway spots. This might be an interesting idea for a video where i try to explain my thoughtprocess on multiway flops.
Hey thanks for the video elusive!! I know you make elite content, but is there any chance that you can maybe make one or two video's on how to crush the lower stakes, just for diversity xD
Cheers! <3
You are welcome VDM,
Maybe but i am not sure. Phil and i believe Sauce had some videos (or at least mentioned it) had some videos about how to adjust at lower stakes.
I'm trying to wrap my head around the fact that PIO suggests ranges where combos are in fractions. To me this is highly impractical but more importantly it obscures meaningful insights. I think PIO needs to be used in a certain way that is more reflective of actual in-game dynamics. for example, preflop mixing of hands can be either done in fractions of .25, .5. or .75. That is to say I can expect a certain player to 3bet AQs 50% of time. Assigning it 33% or any other fraction doesnt make practical sense. How can a player even manage to keep track of which hands he has 3bet what percent of the time and from which position.
Coming to flop, PIO recommending raising 5.9 combos is all good but no player is doing that. wouldn't it better to a) assign post flop actions based on flop texture and range advantage? if the OOP shouldnt have a check raising range then dont set it as option in PIO. This will obviosuly affect the combos that can be bluffed raised
b) i think post flop actions need to be rounded to the nearest .5 or .25. any other fraction is meaningless. not because no player would ever be able to play in those fractions but mainly cause it obscures insight from PIO. this would help us under stand how to play certain types of draws.
PIO plays perfectly vs PIO. So both inputs try to maximum exploit each other which comes to an equilibrium.
We don't play vs PIO so betting the right combos x% of the time is impractical and impossible to execute.
When we understand why a solver takes certain lines and we see our opponents take different lines we can try to exploit that. Vs good regs this can be subtle changes by betting slightly more or less with specific draws, valuebets, bluffs etc. VS weaker opponents this can be totally different and we can change direction completely.
RNG can help with the " i want to 3bet this combo x% of the time" .
"You are welcome VDM,
Maybe but i am not sure. Phil and i believe Sauce had some videos (or at least mentioned it) had some videos about how to adjust at lower stakes."
Oh ok ill check them out, i just really like watching your video's :-) , and would love to see one on how to crush lower by you :-) But some of the time your videos are just over my head, im just a microstraker, so maybe im missapplying some stuff im thinking.
Have a good day xD
Great video Mark ! Was wondering how you did the diagram with the preflop hands on your document ?
Thanks olivierp,
I used this site: https://www.grafiektool.nl/
But this one is in Dutch. I am sure just googling it that u can find a bunch of sites where u can make diagrams and similair things.
Wicked video Mark. very informative spotted a few leaks in my game already, any chance you can do the same for BTN vs BB where the ranges are wider? Thanks again keep up the good work.Good luck at the tables.
Yep i think so!
hi Mark, your exploit vs a OOP 100% c-bet on most neutral / better for IP boards was to raise IP more often, which I totally agree with and is useful since most players in my live pool c-bet way too high on almost any boards and never check/raise as PFA (unless with sets). Tough we often lack credibility when we do it, they still can't defend enough anyway
however when I was running sims (with more loose range for the opener like HJ/CO or vs BU cc), to my surprise, on some board like J43r, the exploit was not to raise IP more often but to call with 100% range (the problem is when we call 100% and they keep barreling on turn, our IP continuing range is so weak)
how can you explain that on some boards the raise frequency stays the same vs over c-bet and the right PIO strategy is to mostly call and not raise? how do you then proceed on later streets ? Thanks!
I'm interested to see the aggregation reports. Is there anything meaningful we can find? Is 50 boards enough for something like this, or would there be too much sampling bias?
Thanks!
Be the first to add a comment
You must upgrade your account to leave a comment.