Nice video!
The last hand, pio show hero should bet/allin Aq,k8s,q8o,k9s,k9o, it's really interesting, are you prefer to jam this range in river with blocker in hand? especial IF the Aq combos not including in hero's bb 3bet range, so jam the river, is it reasonable?
Certainly seems reasonable to be jamming these hands. Not a run out where there are endless combos that remain unpaired and blocking the nuts and some of the strongest top pairs seems useful. That said, Kx and Qx also block villains bluffs somewhat. Glad you liked the vid.
Interesting topic. It appears my strategies are WAY off, much too passive, especially on the K22 board.
PIO is certainly not a Negreanu fan, no small-ball here.
Good vid. Using examples to generalize how to optimize the game. Also your talk of how the playerpool can make mistakes is helpful. Some fun also to see My own nick at the table in one of the hands.
-It looks like you are only exploring our strategy vs. an optimal c-betting strategy in these check raise spots, but aren't modifying villain's cbet strategy and node locking to explore the best exploitative strategy for hero. Is that correct?
-If so, do you often node lock when using pio, or are you more interested in viewing the initial GTO strategies to explore optimal bet sizes and frequencies? I'm new to the software and trying to learn how to use it effectively.
So it's an ongoing learning process for me as well. In general I haven't been node locking, because - being new to the software - I'm interested in both players strategies. By studying both strategies - IP and OOP, range advantage and disadvantage - I get more out of each individual solve. They take a long time to run and review after all! As you're understanding of the way GTO strategies interact you can begin to introduce node locking to see what exploits to make. That's way round I've approached things, anyway. Hope that helps.
Thanks! That is helpful and I have had a similar approach. I've tried to play around with node locking a bit but every time I try it seems like I'm wasting time and not getting much done. I really like that exploring multiple bet size GTO solutions can reveal a lot about an easy simplified one size strategy we can use for a given spot. I've been finding that Pio prefers smaller sizings in a lot of flop spots even with deeper effective stacks!
I think I've been stuck in a rut of not wanting to cr a lot of hands for fear of "turning them into a bluff", eg 55 on k22. but pio looks to want to cr these for value/protection. this then lets the ip player realise all of their equity
I think this may be a leak of mine, anyone have any comments on this?
are we "generally" only getting called by hands that beat us? is this ok thought because the benefit of protection outweighs this?
how is this strategy effected when against utg for instance where villains range is tighter?
These are understandable questions and worries. Until recently, top tournament players, in the UK certainly, would have thought raising 55 on K22 was awful - to take your example.
The important thing is to try and picture things in equilibrium. If opponents aren't generally calling with anything beating 55, then our bluffs print and we fold out huge amounts of our opponents equity. if we can pick up on their imbalance, then we'll also have very easy turn and river decisions. So it isn't a huge worry for us.
We should be thinking similarly about situations where the villain's range is tighter. There certainly will be flops and turns where our craise frequency is lower because our opponents range is stronger than ours. However, there are also flops and run outs where a tight range can leave an opponent lacking in board coverage and create very profitable bluffing spots. It's all about how the two ranges interact.
I know this is quite general stuff, but I hope it helps.
You say that you've understood it from PIO that the OOP player shouldn't slowplay very much, but instead call down with bluff catchers and raise their value. Surely this is mostly because in the hands you ran simulations on, the stacks are less than 50bb. If we are in a cash game 200bb deep, surely slowplaying a decent amount of nut combinations is detrimental?
Hi there. Maybe you've slightly mis-typed? Are you suggesting that 200bb deep we need to slow play more or less?
I don't want to come off as if I have all the answers. Certainly haven't run many sims at 200bb stack depth. However, speaking in general terms, as I understand it, PIO suggests that GTO strategies involve raising more post-flop with strongest hands than the tournament player pool has been doing. I imagine that applies to nearly all stack depths and certainly at 200bb+
In the last had PIO prefers to go all in with AcQx but not with the QcAx because the QcAx doesn't block the opponents AcXc hands so we can check down and win against more hands?
Very nice video Sam. That K22 board strategy from BB was quite eye opening. Very nice field for further videos would be how ICM pressure modifies these spots. I mean, lets imagine the hand was played on final table between two bigstacks, you probably dont want to start by c/r 30% on this board.
Thanks for the reply and glad you liked the video. At the moment I can't say I'm clear about how exactly ICM alters post-flop strategies. As most regs do, I avoid placing myself in spots where my range is weak and I'm going to be bluff-catching run outs when ICM is a factor. Not sure if anyone out there has a clearer understanding of how it affects strategies than me. Seems possible that they do, but I'm not privy to it at the moment.
hi first time watching one of your videos. it was great and i really liked how you scrolled over a lot of the specific hands so we can see some equities. Would appreciate even some more of these for the interesting raising combos which ppl wouldnt normally figure to raise.
At 31 min. w KQ on K xxss you call his A4ss ALL IN hand total spew but you never go over his spot w A4ss flush draw. When you go over the play for IP after getting CR on this board. It shows he should 3b some hands like AA often, and AK and Kq sometimes.
why do we reraise AK less often than KQ here for IP vs the check raise on this flop?
It shows that he has some raising range with some A2s-A4s. And even some A5-A7ss although very small. But A2ss- A4ss has some more raising range.
If you scroll over to his actual play w A4ss how often does it say to raise??? doesnt seem like 0%
My guess is some small percent would raise in his spot. Why else is it orange colored for the raise range?
Sometimes PIO looks to float some of the CR's in these examples with one spade type hands. for example if weget CR on K 6 2 ss It tells us to call 90% w a hand like Jh10s that cbet the flop(shown at 28.57) it says we should 3b the flop for ip 8% of the time with this hand.
If we can 3b the flop 8% of the time w Jh10s, how often does it say we can shove A4ss. you never showed us and just called it spew.
How often does an actual person do this? i never see these kinds of floats, it seems like spew. But PIO does it being completely balanced i guess i dont understand. Isnt it very hard for a human to be this balanced?
for example on the same hand at 31 min. PIO told us we should CR a very small % of K6 top pair weak kicker which people do not normally do.
How do we go about doing this better if we are trying to learn from PIO
Thanks for the detailed response and sorry I've been slow to reply. I've been grinding live at Aussie Millions every day and haven't had time to sit down in front of a computer.
I understand your frustration at me not covering IP strategy in detail. I certainly shouldn't be making sweeping statements about IP strat if I don't support those statements by sharing the game tree with you guys and girls. It's mainly because the aim of the video is to share some straightforward insights that PIO offers about OOP play. I wanted to summarise these insights and making them easier to implement for subscribers. As a result IP strategies are somewhat neglected in the video, except where they pertain to OOP decision-making.
That said, I don't think it's unreasonable to call the A4s jam a spew. You can see that I offered PIO the opportunity to call, reraise to 13000 or shove and the solver doesn't shove at all, suggesting that this a very poor response from the villain. It's also common-sensical. We're in a real coffin with lower flush draws vs a reraise where as a lot of them can simply be folded to a jam.
It's obviously quite challenging to crib the key insights from a pretty complicated game tree for viewers, but I certainly appreciate feedback like this and maybe I'll do a video soon where I just take one, or maybe two, hand and examine both IP and OOP strategies in greater depth.
Really nice wid, Im waiting for video with turn strategy after c/r flop, IP and OOP, becouse as we see ppl are way more spew against c/r than PIO recommends
Thanks chester. Hope the grind is going for you. My next few vids have already been submitted, but I'll bare in mind your suggestion once I'm back to Europe and making more.
Great video Sam, thank you! Would you be able to discuss the bet sizes that you chose, especially for OOP x/r of 2.2x and 3x? Did you have a preference to one sizing before this video? (Your x/r seemed quite small on the whole). How has PIO affected your thoughts on optimal sizing in these spots? Does it depend on board texture, ranges etc?
I can pretty confidently state from running a decent amount of sims with tournament stack sizes (50bb and below) that PIO really likes to utilise a small craise 2.2x or 2x to protect equity and gain value. On the more dynamic boards it understandably upsizes to 3x.
This sizing is a lot smaller than tournament players have generally used up to this point and that makes sense. We've generally been incredibly polarized craising from the blinds and PIO suggest we can push equity with a wider range of hands than we've selected up until now and also select more bluffs - hence the smaller sizing!!!
I can also say I've had a decent amount of success utilising this strategy in game. Hope you get on with it just as well.
How are you proceeding on turns when called with these middling hands like 55 on k22ss that are ahead of range when raising but in no mans land when called
55 seems like a clear check, as would weaker Kx. We can still show down verse and win verse decent portion of their Ax range, but is not a good hand to start bluffing with.
It might seem like this is a strategy that leaves us in 'no-mans land' when we craise, but are we any better off when we check call? It really helps to try and picture things at equilibrium. Imagine all the equity we fold out when villain bet-folds T9, 89 and the like. If they fold every hand that is beat by 55 we print on the craise, if they call with too many unpaired hands with over-cards we print with strong Kx and flush draws.
I honestly think if you start to implement the strategies discussed in the video you'll see how effective they are.
Indeed. Obviously the nature of one 'insight' leads to further questions and you've identified a natural follow-up. Can't fit everything in to one video, but it's definitely an idea for a future vid.
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Nice video!
The last hand, pio show hero should bet/allin Aq,k8s,q8o,k9s,k9o, it's really interesting, are you prefer to jam this range in river with blocker in hand? especial IF the Aq combos not including in hero's bb 3bet range, so jam the river, is it reasonable?
Certainly seems reasonable to be jamming these hands. Not a run out where there are endless combos that remain unpaired and blocking the nuts and some of the strongest top pairs seems useful. That said, Kx and Qx also block villains bluffs somewhat. Glad you liked the vid.
n1
Very usefull!
I'm pleased!
Game theory made fun and easy to understand once again. Keep up the great work!
Thanks for the generous comment.
Agreed!
Interesting topic. It appears my strategies are WAY off, much too passive, especially on the K22 board.
PIO is certainly not a Negreanu fan, no small-ball here.
Indeed. Shows we've been way off track in a lot of areas. PIO suggests a real battle for equity down the streets.
Good vid. Using examples to generalize how to optimize the game. Also your talk of how the playerpool can make mistakes is helpful. Some fun also to see My own nick at the table in one of the hands.
Glad you liked the video. I'm sure you'll punish me for it next time we cross paths at the tables.
Great vid Sam!
I have a couple of questions:
-It looks like you are only exploring our strategy vs. an optimal c-betting strategy in these check raise spots, but aren't modifying villain's cbet strategy and node locking to explore the best exploitative strategy for hero. Is that correct?
-If so, do you often node lock when using pio, or are you more interested in viewing the initial GTO strategies to explore optimal bet sizes and frequencies? I'm new to the software and trying to learn how to use it effectively.
Hi there,
Thanks! That is helpful and I have had a similar approach. I've tried to play around with node locking a bit but every time I try it seems like I'm wasting time and not getting much done. I really like that exploring multiple bet size GTO solutions can reveal a lot about an easy simplified one size strategy we can use for a given spot. I've been finding that Pio prefers smaller sizings in a lot of flop spots even with deeper effective stacks!
I think I've been stuck in a rut of not wanting to cr a lot of hands for fear of "turning them into a bluff", eg 55 on k22. but pio looks to want to cr these for value/protection. this then lets the ip player realise all of their equity
I think this may be a leak of mine, anyone have any comments on this?
are we "generally" only getting called by hands that beat us? is this ok thought because the benefit of protection outweighs this?
how is this strategy effected when against utg for instance where villains range is tighter?
These are understandable questions and worries. Until recently, top tournament players, in the UK certainly, would have thought raising 55 on K22 was awful - to take your example.
The important thing is to try and picture things in equilibrium. If opponents aren't generally calling with anything beating 55, then our bluffs print and we fold out huge amounts of our opponents equity. if we can pick up on their imbalance, then we'll also have very easy turn and river decisions. So it isn't a huge worry for us.
We should be thinking similarly about situations where the villain's range is tighter. There certainly will be flops and turns where our craise frequency is lower because our opponents range is stronger than ours. However, there are also flops and run outs where a tight range can leave an opponent lacking in board coverage and create very profitable bluffing spots. It's all about how the two ranges interact.
I know this is quite general stuff, but I hope it helps.
You say that you've understood it from PIO that the OOP player shouldn't slowplay very much, but instead call down with bluff catchers and raise their value. Surely this is mostly because in the hands you ran simulations on, the stacks are less than 50bb. If we are in a cash game 200bb deep, surely slowplaying a decent amount of nut combinations is detrimental?
Hi there. Maybe you've slightly mis-typed? Are you suggesting that 200bb deep we need to slow play more or less?
I don't want to come off as if I have all the answers. Certainly haven't run many sims at 200bb stack depth. However, speaking in general terms, as I understand it, PIO suggests that GTO strategies involve raising more post-flop with strongest hands than the tournament player pool has been doing. I imagine that applies to nearly all stack depths and certainly at 200bb+
In the last had PIO prefers to go all in with AcQx but not with the QcAx because the QcAx doesn't block the opponents AcXc hands so we can check down and win against more hands?
There we go!! Thanks mate - very useful.
Very nice video Sam. That K22 board strategy from BB was quite eye opening. Very nice field for further videos would be how ICM pressure modifies these spots. I mean, lets imagine the hand was played on final table between two bigstacks, you probably dont want to start by c/r 30% on this board.
Thanks for the reply and glad you liked the video. At the moment I can't say I'm clear about how exactly ICM alters post-flop strategies. As most regs do, I avoid placing myself in spots where my range is weak and I'm going to be bluff-catching run outs when ICM is a factor. Not sure if anyone out there has a clearer understanding of how it affects strategies than me. Seems possible that they do, but I'm not privy to it at the moment.
hi first time watching one of your videos. it was great and i really liked how you scrolled over a lot of the specific hands so we can see some equities. Would appreciate even some more of these for the interesting raising combos which ppl wouldnt normally figure to raise.
At 31 min. w KQ on K xxss you call his A4ss ALL IN hand total spew but you never go over his spot w A4ss flush draw. When you go over the play for IP after getting CR on this board. It shows he should 3b some hands like AA often, and AK and Kq sometimes.
why do we reraise AK less often than KQ here for IP vs the check raise on this flop?
It shows that he has some raising range with some A2s-A4s. And even some A5-A7ss although very small. But A2ss- A4ss has some more raising range.
If you scroll over to his actual play w A4ss how often does it say to raise??? doesnt seem like 0%
My guess is some small percent would raise in his spot. Why else is it orange colored for the raise range?
If we can 3b the flop 8% of the time w Jh10s, how often does it say we can shove A4ss. you never showed us and just called it spew.
How often does an actual person do this? i never see these kinds of floats, it seems like spew. But PIO does it being completely balanced i guess i dont understand. Isnt it very hard for a human to be this balanced?
for example on the same hand at 31 min. PIO told us we should CR a very small % of K6 top pair weak kicker which people do not normally do.
How do we go about doing this better if we are trying to learn from PIO
Hey there.
Thanks for the detailed response and sorry I've been slow to reply. I've been grinding live at Aussie Millions every day and haven't had time to sit down in front of a computer.
I understand your frustration at me not covering IP strategy in detail. I certainly shouldn't be making sweeping statements about IP strat if I don't support those statements by sharing the game tree with you guys and girls. It's mainly because the aim of the video is to share some straightforward insights that PIO offers about OOP play. I wanted to summarise these insights and making them easier to implement for subscribers. As a result IP strategies are somewhat neglected in the video, except where they pertain to OOP decision-making.
That said, I don't think it's unreasonable to call the A4s jam a spew. You can see that I offered PIO the opportunity to call, reraise to 13000 or shove and the solver doesn't shove at all, suggesting that this a very poor response from the villain. It's also common-sensical. We're in a real coffin with lower flush draws vs a reraise where as a lot of them can simply be folded to a jam.
It's obviously quite challenging to crib the key insights from a pretty complicated game tree for viewers, but I certainly appreciate feedback like this and maybe I'll do a video soon where I just take one, or maybe two, hand and examine both IP and OOP strategies in greater depth.
Cheers, Sam
Really nice wid, Im waiting for video with turn strategy after c/r flop, IP and OOP, becouse as we see ppl are way more spew against c/r than PIO recommends
Thanks chester. Hope the grind is going for you. My next few vids have already been submitted, but I'll bare in mind your suggestion once I'm back to Europe and making more.
solid work
Thanks. Solid response!
Great video Sam, thank you! Would you be able to discuss the bet sizes that you chose, especially for OOP x/r of 2.2x and 3x? Did you have a preference to one sizing before this video? (Your x/r seemed quite small on the whole). How has PIO affected your thoughts on optimal sizing in these spots? Does it depend on board texture, ranges etc?
Hey. Good question.
I can pretty confidently state from running a decent amount of sims with tournament stack sizes (50bb and below) that PIO really likes to utilise a small craise 2.2x or 2x to protect equity and gain value. On the more dynamic boards it understandably upsizes to 3x.
This sizing is a lot smaller than tournament players have generally used up to this point and that makes sense. We've generally been incredibly polarized craising from the blinds and PIO suggest we can push equity with a wider range of hands than we've selected up until now and also select more bluffs - hence the smaller sizing!!!
I can also say I've had a decent amount of success utilising this strategy in game. Hope you get on with it just as well.
How are you proceeding on turns when called with these middling hands like 55 on k22ss that are ahead of range when raising but in no mans land when called
55 seems like a clear check, as would weaker Kx. We can still show down verse and win verse decent portion of their Ax range, but is not a good hand to start bluffing with.
It might seem like this is a strategy that leaves us in 'no-mans land' when we craise, but are we any better off when we check call? It really helps to try and picture things at equilibrium. Imagine all the equity we fold out when villain bet-folds T9, 89 and the like. If they fold every hand that is beat by 55 we print on the craise, if they call with too many unpaired hands with over-cards we print with strong Kx and flush draws.
I honestly think if you start to implement the strategies discussed in the video you'll see how effective they are.
Amazing video! Such great information
Thanks mate. Glad you liked it.
Great topic choice.
Personally id find it really helpful if you were able to run through some different stack depths as well to observe if and how much strategies change.
Indeed. Obviously the nature of one 'insight' leads to further questions and you've identified a natural follow-up. Can't fit everything in to one video, but it's definitely an idea for a future vid.
I wish i had watched this when u first realised it! superb!
Great video
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