CoinPoker Cash Game Championship: The Best Bluffs
Posted by Callum Ross
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Hey Callum,
First hand, can you go a bit into why high offsuit broadways are bad to 4bet bluff when deeper?
17:40 I wonder if the turn wasn't a king would oop still be able to bluff this effectively?
23:30 it almost seems like the q8 player capped himself on the turn. He will have some big hands but this jam on the river seems to lack enough value hands.
One suggestion I would have would be to do the solver analysis right after you show the hand. I had to go back and review the hand before watching the solver portion each time.
Great video!
Glad you enjoyed!
The deeper the stacks and the stronger your opponents range the more important making hands strong than 1pair becomes. Blockers are also less important preflop with deeper stacks.
There are definitely better and worse cards to barrel, straight connecting cards far better for IP than OOP range wise for example so would expect more checking there
Yeah I agree, not a fan of this play at all tbh
Cool video, its great to see these crazy hands under the microscope.
You mentioned here on this turn that AA and KK with a heart will bet more often than without, because they unblock the stabs. Do they unblock the stabs because we don't expect IP to bet too many flush draws at low SPRs because they don't want to bet-fold equity?
If they unblock stabs, then wouldn't it be better to check them, rather than bet? Presumably we want to induce bets with value hands?
Ah yeah maybe I’m messing up my reasoning for the play there, it’s a consistent theme in the silver to bet more as the OOP aggressor in these lower spr spots but as you say looks like I’m getting the reasoning wrong
Yeh I think it's the right heuristic but the wrong logic. I had assumed that AhA would have more equity (blocking strong draws) and be more resistant to heart rivers, so wanted to necessarily increase the pot by betting. Then over-pairs with no heart prefer to check-shove and end the hand now. Not sure that logic is true either, so I guess we are both making the right plays but neither of us knows exactly why!
Haven't seen the hand yet, but what you say sounds right.
AhAx has less fear of being blown off the hand on future runouts, so it bets more often on the flop. Then on the turn AA no heart prefers to XRAI to deny equity from the bluffs. AhAx prefers to keep barreling as the IP range is going to be more PP or Qx heavy and less draws in their range. Where IP is less likely to stab when we block the draws and also less likely to make a polar error with middling PP or TPWK.
With value hands that block draws we keep barreling.
Value hands that unblock draws we XR to deny equity.
Pretty simple right?
Sounds good to me!
At this part of the tree the solver was playing mainly raise/fold with little calling. I think this was a by-product of removing the option for IP to 4bet the flop. Before you removed it I think it was 18% raise frequency, then after it is 41%. If you remove the option for IP to re-raise, and the flop 3bet sizing for OOP is very small, then OOP gets fold equity, maintains the initiative and gets to see the turn all for a very cheap price. I agree with your idea that real humans don't really 4bet IP in this spot though, so perhaps the min 3bet for OOP is in fact a decent play in reality too?
This would definitely Make sense, I do think that in practice humans aren’t 4betting pretty much ever so could be good exploit to 3b flop often, however I also think that humans are too polar as IP, and therefore barrell turn too often for us to want to do this
10s fold has to be a player with a bad internet connection there's no other explanation oop can't even have aqs aks flush and he's also folding himself off a chop vs t8s t9s qts sometimes
also would be interesting to see the ev loss of going smaller in the 5bet KK hand, i would definitely be going for a 2 street game I feel like theres too much money already in the pot to allow ip to even see river on a flop with a flush draw on it
Haha maybe, also possible they just couldn’t think of any bluffs and made a hero fold, however it’s not a good fold imo
Callum,
The Q8dd hand at ~25:00 on Td9s3d turn Tc and river 5h, villain bets 75% pot and fold KK to the jam getting something like 3.5 - 1. Seems like if our opponent can have Q8s here, we are winning often enough to make this call. Seems also like hero is not representing a ton of value here either. Normally this type of player is a bit more noticeable as a loose player, so the KK fold seems too high up in range to fold.
Thanks Callum
Couldn’t agree more :)
Callum,
The AhAx hand that jams river vs TT on KhJs8h turn 9d and river Qh, I was surprised as well to see TT fold here. Interesting that OOP has pretty much zero bets on river, but I guess that makes sense when I think about it. Would be curious to see if TT becomes closer to a fold if OOP is betting flushes and straights for value with the appropriate amount of bluff combos. My guess is that it is still a call, but closer to indifferent. Interesting play by OOP.
Yeah definitely a great spot for IP range vs range
You might end up folding some Tx but never TT as the blockers are too good
Callum,
Great video series. Really enjoyed your analysis of these hands and I look forward to more.
Thanks
Glad you enjoyed!
32:30 on KJ8hh-9x-Qh board we see TT pure calling but ATs / KTs are mixing folds? Given the Kh and Qh are on the board, I think straight+ would be a pure call. Why would ATs/KTs fold? Would like to see you node lock the sets and 2 pairs to fold if villain is folding a straight here. See how much the OOP strategy checks from a range check to perhaps blasting the river.
After watching the video and seeing the solver analysis I'm a bit surprised. I saw this hand on youtube about a week ago. I actually like the way linus played the hand. I'm not sure about the turn or river, but the flop play I really like. When Linus 3bets preflop and then bet + 3bets the flop he unblocks some bluffs that have GS + BDFD or OESD T9s and also blocks value 87s/77. The flop 3bet I really like. On the river 76s is an interesting choice to bluff or bluff catch given T9s bricked out and then 3 combos of 65s that had OESD + BDFD. I was surprised to see the solver preferring clubs here over spades.
Also why can't you share their names? Youtube shared their names.
TT is a better call than these as it blocks more value and max unblocks bluffs, also in the sim you’re only meant to have ThTx after calling flop so you also block flushes.
I guess this is as you want IP to have 87cc as that mixes at least some folds
These hands were released on Coinpoker’s twitter with fans voting for their favourite play, whoever won the vote got access to a 20knl vip game. They wouldn’t release screen names as viewers would naturally be biased to their favourite players
Nice review Callum, love these Coin champ content - some very ballsy moves are fun to watch!
ps - your voice is extremely soothing in this vid haha, consider doing some poker asmr? xD
Glad you enjoyed!
Haha, maybe a retirement plan ��
hey callum another wicked video my guy thank you
pretty wicked runout here, what are we doing with 10x facing this shove?
pretty wicked hand here, cold 4 bet pot, was thinking AQ going for the BXB. When JJ does bet this river AQ just rips kinda crazy JJ doesnt beat any value. I wonder if JJ does just Check this river if he himself can call the shove on the river anyway but likely still folding.
pretty insane river shove here with ATss
questions 1. does JJ have to block bet this river? likely only called by better and we sort of hate life when we get shoved on. i sort of like checking this river re evaluating but again if A10 rips it we hate it as well facing the jam,
can ATss bet this turn? we pick up ton of equity, but i guess we can check and realize as well.
Insane indeed! Can’t say I think it’s a good play, not even sure if it’s value or a bluff though I lean towards the former
Not a mandatory block imo, I’d guess Evs of x and block are the same
I think not (if so I’d guess infrequently), as the hand suffers too much at this spr vs the x jam
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