184 Flops When BTN 3B's the CO

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184 Flops When BTN 3B's the CO

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EluSiVeMark

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184 Flops When BTN 3B's the CO

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EluSiVeMark

POSTED Apr 21, 2019

Mark Lammers aka EluSiVeMark takes a theoretical approach to examine c-betting strategies after having 3bet on the BTN vs CO. After a short visualization of the range distribution Mark examines the PIO results on 184 different flops with a powerful excel sheet he created.

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Starney Binson 5 years, 11 months ago

Great video Mark! Question - on the Q high boards, we saw the big sizing used on monotone boards more often and the smaller size used on fd boards. Intuitively I would have thought that it would have been the other way around, as on fd boards we want to 'charge' fd's more to see a turn. I thought about it a bit more and figured that the big sizing might be used on mono boards to disincentivize bd floats, while on the fd boards the fd is gonna continue vs any size so going smaller and getting folds from air for cheaper is beneficial. Does my reasoning seem logical here or am i missing something?

EluSiVeMark 5 years, 11 months ago

I guess with monotone u mean rainbow? Anyway a big reason for smaller sizings on flushdraw boards is that a lot of OOP continuingsrange is going to contain flushdraw, no matter the sizing we use. But if we start to use larger sizings he will fold his weak no fd type of hands, meaning we are screwed when the flush comes in. Also we don't really have too much of an suited hands advantage. If our range compared to his has more suited hands then i believe we can go larger again. (maybe nice to try out in PIO)

Metanoia 5 years, 10 months ago

Awesome content Mark, I watched the whole series and enjoyed it a lot.

Question - on K high dry boards, we do a lot of big betting on KK6tt and KK4r, but only small betting on KK9r and KKTr. Intuitively, I thought it would have been the other way around (charging gutshots). Can you explain this thing ? Is it because a small bet does the job on KK9r and KKTr to get all the pocket pairs to fold, which is not the case on KK6 and KK4 ?

EluSiVeMark 5 years, 10 months ago

Hey Meta,

Glad to hear u enjoy the videos.
So a reason for small betting is to get a bunch of autofolds. Betting 2/3 of 1/3 vs PIO doesn't impact the folding frequency of his gutters which always continue. Betting 1/3 or 2/3 vs his underpairs also doesn't impact the folding frequency that much on KK9, which will fold at a very high frequency. So i think your reasoning is very good!

feat.random 5 years, 10 months ago

very nice work Mark! i suggest for your next video the IP decision when OOP X/R the flop in this spot, BTN v CO 3BP. This situation occurs really frequently, as oop has to defend by X/R a lot in 3BP, especially vs low sizings.

EluSiVeMark 5 years, 10 months ago

So i cannot really do this in an excel sheet i believe. But i have an idea on how to come up in a couple of spots like this in practise.

IIIIIIIlIlIlI 5 years, 8 months ago

I see that your button strategy involves button flats and also 3 bets. I'm playing a 3b+fold strategy on the button and the simulations for that seem a little weird because my range is so wide - obviously need to check more when were 3betting more hands because our range is weaker

I feel like this might be a sign that the 3b range is too wide if I have to check this much across that many boards? I put a 3bet % of 15 so 3 more than what you put here.


Seems strange to check this much on low card boards when we're IP

EluSiVeMark 5 years, 8 months ago

I think having only a 3betting range 15% is fine. I guess you have the OOP player flatting a bunch of mid pairs. Then it makes sense to check a lot on these types of boards. He is going to have more nutted combos than you.
Your betting frequency or checking frequency doesn't really tell you you 3bet too much or not enough. If you face 4bets that you cannot defend properly vs then you probably 3bet too much. (Which again can be fine when OOP doesn't 4b enough)

IIIIIIIlIlIlI 5 years, 8 months ago

Ty, do you have any tips on separating the fd boards between non fd when scripting? I tried to run 2 separate scripts but it doesnt put them in the same order so I have to manually put the second one in excel after.

EluSiVeMark 5 years, 8 months ago

When u run a script you can change the boards. So if u have AdJd2c in the first script, make it AdJs2c in the other. This is all manually though. Then it should all be in order.

ibotown 5 years, 7 months ago

Very nice Video, very easy to follow and a lot of insights. There where a lot of spots that i expected to be played different!

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