Out of the Box Hands
Posted by Alexandra Fagaras
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Alexandra,
The 65s hand at 13:00 is interesting. How often do you think that villain is using these sizing's with top pair (AK, AQ, A5s)? I would guess these small bet sizes across 3 streets should never really happen, so it is just a guessing game what he shows up with. I would think that this line is going to be very polar consisting of top set/boat or a hand that wants to show down cheap, like KK, QQ or some other value that doesn't want to play for stacks. If this is true, raising river most likely folds out most of the hands you beat and gets called by better. Interested in your thoughts on this and what hands you would guess villain calls all in with here.
Thanks
Yeah I agree it's going to be mostly top set or a weaker value hand that doesn't wanna play for stacks. However there's many more combos available of weaker value than top boat. And once population bets so small in spots where a lot of draws miss they tend to get pretty call happy with bluffcatchers as well (obviously depends on villain) so I thought there should be enough bluffcatchers to make this a profitable shove at this SPR but not really sure tbf :))
I would have snap shoved here on the river vs the block bet. Was kinda surprised to see that it was a borderline decision in the solver.
I can't imagine many people are 4betting 99 or TT UTG vs MP all too often, so perhaps there's a reduced frequency of those hands. From my experience players will likely take this line with AQ quite frequently too, so it's probably a little closer to a value shove than your node-locked solution which had 65s as a check IMO. Still super close though.
Yeah I agree, these are good points
There was something I saw from one of your previous videos that I wanted to ask you about; I saw that you 3bet when in position vs a rec to a much larger size than is standard, e.g. 2BB>9BB. I thought this was an interesting idea and had a few questions about it.
Is the idea that the rec will over-call and under-4bet, so the larger size gives you more value with your linear 3betting range?
Is this something you only do vs recs?
Do you keep the same 3betting range as previously, or do you need to trim some of the marginal hands?
Do you use a more "standard" 3bet sizing when out of position?
Have you noticed any big changes in the way players react to this sizing as compared to a default smaller 3bet sizing?
It's something I'm keen to implement, so would be great to hear your thoughts and experience on using this!
Here is an example. Something I also noticed here was this player had 45% VPIP, so my final question is whether you would do the same vs a rec playing 30% VPIP?
Sorry for the late reply, must have skipped this.
Yeah I'd say it's a great exploit vs recs for the reasons you mentioned, but also cause they're likely to make a bunch of postflop mistakes so in general we want to play bigger pots when we're IP vs these guys. I think it's also a good exploit vs weaker regs who won't adjust (OOP should basically only 4bet or fold vs that size and when they find too many calls we already exploit them). As for the range, vs recs 3betting range will be quite wide (obviously depends on how wide they open / call as well, it might even be much wider than a normal 3bet range).
OOP again it depends, vs recs I think 3betting according to hand strength (as long as they're big fish and inelastic) works well.
Sometimes there are differences in the way they react (they might fold some extra hands) but generally they will still massively overcall, which will probably give us more EV in the long run.
No problem, thanks for the info! I think its a great idea and I have been trying to implement it here and there. Just looking at some data for recs, the lack of 4bets is most prominent when OOP to the 3bettor, so that will really add to our EV when making this play. And like you said, vs the bigger sizing OOP should 4bet way more frequently (or even play 4bet or fold) and yet recs won't know this and will continue to call wide.
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