PLO 10$ ZOOM / Turn play

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PLO 10$ ZOOM / Turn play

BN: $7.70
SB: $17.93
BB: $16.64
UTG: $17.02
HJ: $10
CO: $9.95 (Hero)
Hi Guys
Best of luck for 2014 !

I decided to work my game, add review and discussion on a forum.

So, let's go :)

No specific read on Vilain, first orbit with him.
Preflop ($0.15) (6 Players)
Hero was dealt K A 4 J
UTG raises to $0.35, HJ folds, Hero raises to $1.15, BN folds, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls $0.80
Flop ($2.45) J 5 7 (2 Players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $1.80, UTG calls $1.80
On the flop, I m ready to bet/push if raised.
When he called this kind of flop I guess he had a lot of JXXX, OverpairXX, and str8 draw. I m not sure of that at all...
Turn ($6.05) J 5 7 9 (2 Players)
UTG checks, Hero checks
Now...
I thought most of his weak/strong draw came. Bet/ fold cannot be an option due to FD ? Do you consider this option if you knew vilain calls a lot of flop bet & passive ? Bet/call raise/shove ? I would have done that with more than a naked flush draw, let's say + top 2, set or bigger str8 draw with the FD. Wrong ?

I decided to check and of course....
River ($6.05) J 5 7 9 6 (2 Players)
UTG bets $5.79, Hero folds
Final Pot
UTG wins $5.79

Thanks for reading.

4 Comments

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ZenFish 11 years, 2 months ago

The preflop 3B is thin against an UTG open (would like it more on the BTN vs a loose/bad opener). It's a good flatting hand, though, and you don't mind a multiway pot.

As played, c-betting the flop with TPTK + backdoors in position can't be bad as such, but I think checking makes a lot of sense with a hand that isn't particularly strong on the flop, but has so many improving turns.

Any jack, ace, king or heart are very good, a four also improves your showdown value, and queens, tens, threes and deuces give you gutshots. So around 2/3 of the deck improves you. That means when you check back the flop, you'll be able to defend against a bet on most turns. And on bad turns, you still might get checked to, and can bet or take a free card.

For argument's sake, let's pretend you're microcrusher in an alternate universe. Alternate-microcrusher likes balanced flop checking ranges, so he checks back this flop. He hits one of his plentiful good turn cards, namely the 9h. Let's think about how the hand will play out for him when Villain checks or bets:


Case 1: Villain checks the turn

Now I think a turn bet is a must. Villain called a 3-bet and checked twice, so his range is likely quite weak. You have now maneuvered yourself into a postflop spot where you can take full advantage of information, position, and leverage, because you have:

1. A range that isn't totally capped. You don't have a flopped set, and you probably have many one pair-hands, but you might have turned the nuts, and you definitely could have a monster draw. Because alternate-microcrusher will check back some decent-but-not-great hands that sometimes turn very strong equity.

2. In actuality you have TPTK  + a nut draw, which is a good hand to semibluff when you're unlikely to get check-raised. And you don't have to make the flush to win. Often two pair will be good enough to show down after getting check-called. Even unimproved top pair will be good sometimes (but you might elect to use that as a river bluff). And you have fold equity.

3. Leverage. By betting the turn, you are threatening Villain's whole stack with one bet. If he has a bluffcatcher with few outs, all he can do is call and pray you don't bet the river. Often, it would be best for him to fold, if he doesn't have any good outs to go along with his showdown value.

Case 2: Villain bets the turn

On some improving cards (like Kh) you could have raised, but on the 9h it seems best to call. You have a decent draw with showdown value, but could be up against the nuts and getting shoved on would be a disaster.

Since you'll have lots of draws in your calling range, Villain will have to check many a river. And if he doesn't, he's donating implied odds to your draws! Because he can't get it exactly right. Either he checks too many rivers and give you opportunity to valuebet/bluff/check back perfectly, or he bets too many rivers and donate implied odds (calling/valueraising + bluffraising opportunities).

So while you would have prefered case 1, you don't mind case 2 at all with plenty of money behind. You're in position with a decent hand/draw, and Villain will have to play the river OOP. And this would have been the case on lots of other turn cards as well.

So the flop check didn't set you up for having to fold lots of turns, or other unpleasant turn/river decisions. You will often get to the river with a hand that has outs and is easy to play well in position.

What was the point of this story?

To show that hands can play out quite differently, and often very comfortably and to your benefit, when you choose the right types hands for checking back the flop. A hand can seem like an obvious flop bet in isolation (say, with TPTK + decent backdoors), but ask yourself a couple of questions:

- Am I really looking to stack off the flop?
- Do I give up significant equity/playability if I bet-fold?
- Is there a risk of getting check-raised?

Then look ahead to future streets and ask:

- Do I really give up anything by delaying my c-bet until the turn?
- Will it be easy for Villain to play turns and river OOP vs this hand if I check it on the flop?


If the answers are "no", "yes", "yes" for the first three questions, strongly consider checking back. And even if you could c-bet the flop profitably, consider checking back anyway if the answers to the last two questions are firmly "no" and "no".

Because checking back a decent hand could be better both in a vacuum and for your checking range. You need a flop checking range, and it's good for you to have some hands in there that can bet, call or raise on many turns.

/end alternate universe check-back story


Teddy 11 years, 2 months ago

Good post Zen. You need an opponent that raise/folds flops a lot in 3-bet pots to 'adjust' and bet/get in here.

microcrusher 11 years, 2 months ago

Hi

Great Thanks a lot for the answer and the time you took to did it.

I guess I had a big issue here. I played today and try to apply the concept. Good i found some spots more easier by checking and did a lot of bluff vs double check. Actually each time I did not want to be C/R I checked.

Now I guess I should take care to not go too far and give some freecards in some spots. Again, thanks a lot.


Cheers.


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