nut wrap vs dumb&dumber
Posted by spassewr
Posted by
spassewr
posted in
Mid Stakes
nut wrap vs dumb&dumber
BB: 3bets 57% over 145 hands mostly from the sb, but sample is to small to know whether he knows/cares about which position he 3bets from/vs. cbet is a whopping 90% in any srp 2way-4way. cbet 3b pot 20/20. cbet fold srp 5/9, cbet fold 3b pot 2/4. he does however 3bet small a lot, so this pot size raise may mean stronger hand/range. his cb sizing differs too, no good reads on it, pb doesnt seem to mean a strong hand but this sizing is prob a weak hand or a draw.
BTN: another maniac, but compared to bb, he's basically Phil Ivey. 3bets btn vs co about 20%ish flats about 50%. pretty passive post flop, but when he does bet/raise he pots it and never folds (ive seen him pot donk QJ42+3rd nfd in a 3way 3b pot 350bbs deep and gii vs the 3bettors pot raise). when he raises tho, he will be very weighted towards Q2+ and strong draws.
1) do we 4bet pre (remember that a large % of bbs squeezes is tiny squeezes and 3bets)
2) do we raise flop?
3) do we gii as played?
btn has 340 behind, and bb 440 and ive got them both covered.
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I think given that we have position vs BB, calling is probably better than 4betting. I would think of 4betting if we are double-suited. I will call otf and fold against a raise and overcall since it is too likely that one of them has a flushdraw which hurts our hands by a lot.
1) i think it's not mandatory but isnt a bad option neither. by calling you reduce variance and have room to play postflop poker
2) no, i wouldnt given the SPR you risk too much and are behind any reasonable GII range
3) I actually think we can call the raise since we close the action, get 3:1 and have pretty good visibility: when we turn the nuts we shove, if the flush hits or the board pairs we fold, if an unpaired club hits or on a blank we have the EQ to call a shove.
You are right. I did compare folding flop vs your strategy and the ladder shows more profit(roughly 80$ more).
Yea thats what i thought in-game too "good odds and a bunch of nut outs and bdfd" but just wanna double check what the correct math is here....
Since we well be up against 2p+ and a fd almost always and sometimes a set or combo nfd and a str8 draw and or fd even when we turn the nuts we may only have 40-60%eq due to us having to dodge so many rivers (or chopping)....can we draw profitably to a hand that doesnt have guaranteed eq when we are not really getting immediate odds?
Feel like i couldve phrased that better but u get what i mean i hope :)
Played it fine, never folding flop against a probably made hand and undefined hand from agro fish.
@ jim: true, but tbh i had no clue if my equity was 22ish% or 30% even tho im decent at math, i dont end up in a lot of 3way spots with non nut draws where 1 dude has a relatively wide range with a non nut draw (or a str8 draw on a 2tone board in this case)....im not used to be one calling off huge chunks of my stack with a draw...assumed my eq was somewhere inbtw. 22-30% ran some numbers today, acc to that i had 28% vs their ranges.
gave bb: hh,T9+,(Q,J):(T8,AT,AK),AKQ+ minus QJ+
and btn: QJ+,Q:(Khh),KKhh,Ahh:(Q,J,T,K),AKT:hh,KT9:hh,T98:hh.
according to pokerjuice i have 67-75% eq on: Ac/As Kd/Ks 9c/8c
50-60% eq on: Td/Tc 9s 8s/8d
40-45% eq on: 7d 4d 3d
so myea, gotta call there.
interesting bc i ended up folding in both of these wrap hands (this one and wrap vs smart&smarter)....tbh i didnt notice that we still had 300-400 left to play in this one after grinding 6hrs straight but i may have ended up folding anyway bc i thought my eq was actually in the low-mid 20s. i guess the extra three 8s and the bdnfd makes all the difference, as well as getting 2-1 on a guaranteed turn card.
the one i thought may have been a mistake was the check fold AJT9 on KQ4r altho i thought it may only have been a small mistake. turns out even tho the board was rainbow, that was actually the good fold out of the two ^^.
thx for responses and calcs guys, I learned something today :)
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