Fundamental theory question!!! Why does solver constantly valueprobe OOP with less than 50% equity vs the calling range?
Posted by kingofnaps
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kingofnaps
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Fundamental theory question!!! Why does solver constantly valueprobe OOP with less than 50% equity vs the calling range?
The question is in the title. Why does solver constantly valueprobe 1/4 pot sized bet with less than 50% equity vs the calling range? I remember this being in Matthew Janda's book Applications of No Limit Holdem but I can't remember what it said. It was something about probing 1/4 and the EV we take away from his would-be bluffs had we checked, in combination with our equity when called though it's less than 50%, makes the small probe better than check/calling, check/calling being 0EV because we call our bluffcatcher vs the opponent's balanced range. Janda showed some math for this and it made sense to me at the time but that was a decade ago and I can't remember the math for it nor can I figure it out conceptually for myself. I don't understand his bluffs having EV when part of a balanced stabbing range if we check our marginal hands instead of probing them for 1/4 pot. I don't understand how a bluff in a GTO range can have EV when we're responding with GTO.
I really hope someone can answer this for me. I think it's really interesting and I'm certainly misplaying those spots because I refuse to just blindly stab 1/4 with all kinds of 3rd and 4th pairs and stuff when we are clearly getting wrecked by the calling range, even though the solver says that's what I should do. I would like to know the theory behind it so I understand how it works and then I can actually have a reason to start making those kinds of weird value block bets with trash.
Thank you!
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Bump!!! This is a fundamental theory question!
I really hope someone can help me on this matter. You know, like once solvers came out everyone started mixing the actions of OOP river check and probing river for 1/4 pot with like 90% of their 3rd pairs and like 50% of their 4th pairs you know? And when you look in a solver there's always like twice as many hands that call you that beat you than hands that you get value from. So like we probe $10 and lose vs 70% of the calling range but win vs 30% so we're losing 40% of our bet so our probe is literally losing, and huge at that, in isolation. It's literally losing $4 vs the calling range. And that's not even factoring in the high frequency at which villain raises our small probe and we have a -ev or 0ev call so we fold so we lose our probe bet vs that.
So what's the actual theoretical logic behind what's happening?
In what way are we gaining enough by probing small OOP with these terrible hands enough to gain back what we're losing vs the raising and calling ranges of IP?
Thanks so much in advance everyone!
Post a link to a hand/spot in GTOw where solver is doing this
Hello, thanks for responding to my thread! I have not had any free time these days and that is why my response is very delayed.
I only have the 1 free spot per day from GTO wizard and will try to find one. It may take me a while though, but as soon as I find one I will post a reply in here! Thanks for your time!
Hey guys I just made an account here I have some solver questions but I can't start a thread does anyone know why?
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