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What is your calling range OOP from UTG vs 3bets?

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Posted by posted in Low Stakes

What is your calling range OOP from UTG vs 3bets?

It is quickly possible to say that the equity of all pairs exceeds the pot odds in a spot that we are faced with a 4x bet from the villainous IP.

vs 4x 3bet we do have: 34% pot odds

Let's see:

avg 3bet V's range: 100: JJ+, AQs+, AQo+, 50: TT, KQo (66.15%% = value hands / 33.85% = bluff hands)

Equity calc

Equity
62.25% 100: JJ+, AQs+, AQo+, 50: TT, KQo }
37.75% 2s2c

Questions:

  1. Should we continue to defend a tight range from UTG vs 3bet?

callin ': 99-JJ, AQs
4bet / fold: AKo, KJs +
fold: 88-22, AJs-A2s, KTs-K9s, Q9s +, J9s +, T8s +, 98s, 87s, 76s, 65s, 54s, AQo-ATo, KJo +

In micro-low stakes is it no longer worth adding pairs like 44-88 in order to just play in sets? Mathematically it is possible to defend 22+.

Well, does anyone here believe that this line makes sense? Or that it doesn't make any sense?

5 Comments

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maco 4 years, 2 months ago

Against a 4x 3bet oop I'm def calling very tight and mostly 4bet or fold. Now it depends if you get a 3bet from the MP or BTN. BTN 3bet range should be wider. But I would chose combos like ATs/AJs to bluff and fold KJs. And if you dont feel comfortable to 4bet/call with AKo, you should better putt it in your calling range and not 4bet/fold.

RaoulFlush 4 years, 2 months ago

The question to me would be if 22 should be in our RFI-range in UTG. My solver suggests to always call pairs vs a 3bet if we opened them. And that is related to somwehat whide 3betting ranges.
But it also recommends to just open 66+ pure in UTG and mix in the lower pairs. So imo we could simply cut out these small pairs and then defend the other ones vs 3bets.
But we should not look static at these equity-numbers here imo. Im pretty sure you will rarely be able to realize these 38% equity you mentioned vs most players with dueces.
So we could also let something like 66-88 go if we face a 3bet in UTG. This decision depends a bit how confident you feel playing these hands oop in a 3bet pot.
Nothing wrong with overfolding in general vs 3bets on lower stakes.

TPLancaster 4 years, 2 months ago

my range is different for each position that 3bets me. Im not folding AQ,AJs,KJs,QJs UTG from any 3bet I do mix in some 4bets with AQ and KJs but against wider 3bet ranges and at a very small frequency. If they are 3betting 10% we should defend 60-70% I think so just construct your range based on that ie. 25% of it is a call and 5% is a 4bet the rest is a fold.

The problem is when we get 3bet if we fold we lose our pfr so we lose ie 2.5bb everytime. We want our range to be constructed so that we lose less than 2.5bb when we defend.

HawksWin 4 years, 2 months ago

MateuzEmilio As a general rule, we want to be defending roughly 1/2 our range (either by 4 betting or calling) in this spot. When we open as wide as 22+, we are put in a tough spot facing a 3b regardless of the 3 bettors position. Has TPLancaster described above, we lose 2.5bb to 3bb every time we open and have to fold to 3b. This leaves us with a winrate of -250 to -300bb per 100 hands (if we fold every time we face a 3b). We also have to take it one step further. If we call too wide, we are now investing 10 to 12bb into a pot where we are going to have to x/f the best hand the vast majority of the time when facing heat from both value and bluffs. Now we are looking at a loss rate starts to become quite extreme. We call a 3b with 22-55, see a flop, check and face a c-bet from the BTN who has AK on a J87 board holding the best hand. We either have to x/f or we have to start introducing check/raises in very tricky/marginal spots to cut into the loss rate we are undoubtedly going to have. Out of position we are going to substantially going to under-realize our equity.

I think most UTG 6 max charts are going to suggest opening somewhere between 14 to 18%. Most of these charts aren't taking as much rake into consideration since they are not designed for micro stakes environments. Also, solver based charts are going to construct a "perfect" 3b range for our opponent vs. our opening range. This just doesn't happen in real life. Most micro environments are going to call too often and 3b way less often than they are supposed to. This leaves us in a situation where we open too wide and have to play a pot out of position in a high SPR spot in single raised pots and really puts us in a trick bag when we face a 3b from a range that is much tighter than it should be.

https://gyazo.com/3a676377b3c33595870cbbfdbf4a9346

Take for instance, this 14% opening range from UTG. 77+ (can expand to 66+ probably), all suited K9+, Q9+, J9+ and T9+, ever suited Ax and like AJo+.

https://gyazo.com/bd70e31b99077fd9a0c4f662abbe9acf

Now, look at the above range where we have dropped the bottom 50% or so of the range. Pretty easy to defend right? We drop the two lowest pairs, we drop the suited connectors (they want to play a higher Stack To Pot ratio, especially OOP), we drop some of our Ax suited. If you want to keep in the stuff like KTs, QTs, JTs and play them as calls, so be it. Now we pure 4b AA/KK/AK, we 4b bluff A5/A4 (some of the combos, we can also call with these sometimes since they flop better than something like A8s), and can 4b bluff a few combos of the Ax offsuit and defend the rest of them.

If you compare that type of range vs a 14% linear range, we are still opening the same % but it is constructed in a more efficient manner.

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