What range do you isolate here?
Posted by GeoPur
Posted by
GeoPur
posted in
Low Stakes
What range do you isolate here?
SB: $1.96
BB: $2.12
UTG: $2.00
UTG+1: $2.57
MP: $2.08
MP+1: $2.00
CO: $3.36
At 184 hands CO is 32/0 and limp% is 33 and has folded to a cbet 13/18 times or 72% while only 3/17 times to an isolation. So no preflop fold equity but enough fold equity postlfop. A fit and fold fish. We also have a player at the sb who at 91 hands is 26/2 and who has open limped BTN and CO which shows us that he's very passive(likely to play fit and fold on the flop)as Grinder's Manual Author said in a video.The BB is 16/12 at 1100 hands with only 35% fold to cbet and 3bet of 4.2%. Also fold to steal is 77%(very good).
The BB playing too tight vs steals decreases the chance of multiway pots and the SB playing a bit looser than he should increases it a little. If we sum up those 2 effects it's like it is a defeault scenario(like playing vs 2 average regs) regarding fold equity we have vs the Blinds preflop. Now in this spot multiway pots will happen more frequently vs the scenario where CO folded and hero open raised here, so we might want to tighten our range a little.
Getting heads up with the CO or the SB would be very good because those players fold too much vs a flop cbet. But we'll get some multiway pots sometimes which we do not want with A6o since our fold equity on the flop decreases a lot(if SB was flatting here to our iso a 70% range then things would be not good for A6o. We would need to tighten our range)
So, if we iso with A6o, this means that we iso with A7+ and also with A6s. Would you iso with A2o here? I think it would be ok to do that(with all Aces). I think that if our defeault open range in BTN is about 50% then in this spot, it should be close to that. Maybe 40% iso range.
So, based on the iso triangle the reason we may iso here is mainly for flop fold equity(position helps a little bit also). My main question here is should we tighten our range and if yes then how much?
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Think that in principle it is ok to iso raise with any A here. Having an A means that villains are less likely to have an A and thus less likely that either SB or BB will call.
Flop - ofc course cBet. 1/2 pot should be sufficient against a fit-fold villain I think.
Turn - Fit fold villain called and now bets out. It's time to fold yes I know it is nitty but it is a fit-fold villain so what do you expect he has?
Depends on the Villain. For a generic Villain who sometimes limp/calls and sometimes limp/folds, I iso-raise with A9o+ on the BTN.
As played, I would check flop or bet smaller.
Turn might be a fold.
River you have to call of course.
To elaborate, I used to iso-raise any Ace on the BTN, but in my games, there are a ton of people who limp-call Axs and Axo. I got into reverse implied odds situations so many times that I got sick of it. It might still be profitable to iso-raise any Ace, or go a little bit wider than my range, like A7o+ or A8o+. You just need to beat the lower Aces (which are limp/called more) to make the iso profitable.
Also, offsuit Aces mostly suck to play on the flop, even in position. Often a fish will limp/call preflop with a pocket pair and then call a flop c-bet. Since Axo often flops nothing, I usually have to either give up on the turn, or bluff river a fair bit.
If we play vs a player who is fishy but we don't know what trype of fish they are, what range do we iso? Let's take this spot for example. Let's say that we dont know that CO is a fit and fold fish. In this case do we iso the same range of hands like we would do if he was a sticky fish?
Also do you limp behind weaker aces or fold them here when CO is fit and fold?
Omg. You really don't need to go through all of this to beat 2nl lol. You're playing these hands with the thought of a 50nl or 100nl player and that very well may be your problem. Your opponents aren't thinking they way you would expect them to.
Yes, I need to not overestimate players at these stakes. Sometimes I play vs some regs and I think they are good players, only to see later that they do silly mistakes in a certain spots
Pretty much can isolate same range as you would open BU: 1)If CO is normal rec, not someone who is overly tight(rarely limp) or limp-3bets a ton
2) If blinds are recs or tight opponents (reducing change of getting 3bet)
Keep in mind isolating sizing, you don't want to go smaller than 4x at micro stakes. So essentially for 4x you should not be incredible wide
You confused me a little. Do you mean that you iso same as open when both conditions are met or at least one? What do you mean by saying normal rec?
If we play vs a player who is fishy but we don't know what trype of fish they are, what range do we iso? Let's take this spot for example. Let's say that we dont know that CO is a fit and fold fish. In this case do we iso the same range of hands like we would do if he was a sticky fish?
Yes if both are met.
By normal rec I meant someone who is playing average limping style 30/9 type of guy. Not 30/20 or so, who limps once in a while with hard to define range.
Some sticky fishes play pretty terrible, they might herocall too wide, therefore we won't bluff them but still make a lot of money against the. So I don't have answer should we use same range or not. Possible we can go even wider....
Ok. Thank you! :)
GeoPur It just bothers me that you would even have to play 2nl anymore. Look at how hard you work at this. We went over your stats previously and - they look great. But, of course, the approach you're taking can't hurt and will pay off eventually - hopefully. I didn't mean to say that what you're doing is a strike against you. It's a strike against the current ecosystem that you should have to deal with 2nl at this point.
There are guys I chat with in game who are just like you and then I see them take horrible beats from terrible (legitimately) players. I swear, it almost bothers me as much as my own pots these days. And when I say "terrible players", I'm talking about people who would be terrible at anything they tried. Can't spell, can barely read, can't do even basic math, and honestly don't even know how many cards are in the deck. Just absolutely zero idea of what game they're even playing. I saw one guy at 20nl arguing about why trips beat his two pair. He thought only a set did, not with 2 on board. Dead truth. Instead of laughing, a few of us just /sigh'd and shook our virtual heads.
I am currently playing at NL5(played until now 13k hands but I've lost 9 buy ins. The sample is too small though) as I had said you. I just wanted to study situations with limpers and I read the chapter on Grinder's manual where he said to open my database and filter for situations like this to study. It just happened to be a hand from NL2.
My games are causing me issues (20nl ones) because of the same type of issue. Forget BTN - let's say it's MP or CO facing an open limp with a hand like KJs. Iso'raising the UTG limper, when you know you're going to face multiple callers, doesn't seem right. Neither does calling. It keeps putting me (and I'm sure others) in marginalized spots with absolutely standard opens from the CO, for example. Guys from the blinds know this, too and they're cold calling wide, floating the flop, and then we see a large mw pot, OOP, on a turn and river these guys are more than happy to bluff away at.
Using Power Equilab (or Flopzilla) and looking at these spots - sure, there are times you have an equity advantage but it's just cut so much by the three random ranges in the mix that it makes it extremely difficult to navigate without accepting a high degree of variance.
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