Td9d in 3betpot

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Td9d in 3betpot

Blinds: $0.05/$0.10 (6 Players) BN: $12.52
SB: $22.31
BB: $10.00
UTG: $11.17
MP: $10.30 (Hero)
CO: $11.28
Preflop ($0.15) Hero is MP with T 9
UTG raises to $0.30, Hero calls $0.30, CO folds, SB raises to $1.30, UTG folds, Hero calls $1.00
[P] preflop ok?
Flop ($2.95) 7 2 A
SB bets $1.20, Hero calls $1.20
Turn ($5.35) 7 2 A 4
SB bets $2.65
[T] what if I shove here?

27 Comments

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mattdonk 8 years, 10 months ago

Mp vs utg you don't need to flat that wide, probably close depending on various things but likely too loose in any tough game. Pre flop just fold, again you don't need to defend much especially as the cold caller and this hand is the bottom of your range right?

Shoving turn is bad imo, villian squeeze pre vs utg and Mp who have the strongest ranges possible and then double barrels on a xx. The reason to jam draws is fold equity. Think about villian hand range and what is going to fold? most players at 10nl will have a range of basically aa, ak with this line and even if he has any bluffs they can contain an ace.

Think about positions and ranges, you have minimal fold equity

Q) what if I shove here, a) you get snapped off by ax+ at a very high percentage

sauloCosta10 8 years, 10 months ago

I still think 3-betting is better pre BU vs CO, but flatting should be okay if the blinds aren't squeezing too much. As played I don't think shoving turn accomplishes much, you have basically zero fold equity when you block his bluffing range. Calling seems ok given the odds you are getting and the implied odds you have when hitting a diamond

Kalupso 8 years, 10 months ago

I still think 3-betting is better pre BU vs CO, but flatting should be okay if the blinds aren't squeezing too much.

It is more than strong enough to call OTB and what the best play is depends mostly on COs strategy. If we had a GTO solution it would very likely be used often as both a flat and 3bet.

As played I don't think shoving turn accomplishes much, you have basically zero fold equity when you block his bluffing range. Calling seems ok given the odds you are getting and the implied odds you have when hitting a diamond

All FDs should clearly be +EV calls IP against that bet size. Not even close.

I too would not recommend having a raising range here, but if you do not raise flop you should have enough AK+ or AdQd+ to raise turn. I would not raise this hand anyways and 2x+FD, 4x+FD and GS+FD would be better bluff raises.

Pokerlogical 8 years, 10 months ago

I prefer T9s in my flatting range because our outs are always kind of fcked up if we 3bet and he calls by the fact vilain can have stuff like 99,TT,ATs and if we hit straightdraws the board usually connects with villains range for example we flop OESD on QJ2 villain can have KQs, AQs, AJs, JJ, QQ so the only reason that would be acceptable for me to 3bet T9s is if we either have a lot of FE pre or board coverage.

I'd be much more inclined to 3bet stuff like 87s 76s 65s 54s and A2s-A5s :)

I'm not so sure about calling this squeeze pre...I think his range is too strong and I don't feel like we have enough implieds to call.

Flop is a clear call... not only can we stack him if we hit our flush but also we can bluff if he checks the turn to us. So we combine these two factors plus the fact that we get 3:1 makes it a call for me.

Turn is just a clear fold. We have no reason to assume that he is gonna fold anything to our shove and calling seems too optimistic.

Mercurius 8 years, 10 months ago

Theyre 2 or 3 days I had tell you when you asking why you don't win at nl10 than it probably was because you was making a lot of crazy things thinking than you have to be very aggro.

Shove this turn is one of this crazy idea.
;)

Kalupso 8 years, 10 months ago

Very much this! There are guys who never bluff that has more than 5bb/100 winrate a at these soft 10NL games. I am not saying never bluffing is optimal, but it is a lot better than bluffing too much and making too many plays instead of giving up on pots when villain reps a strong range.

A common leak most players at 50NL and lower has (including fish) is to bet too many of their strong and medium hands and check too many weak made hands and air. That means you should respect their aggressive lines a lot, but be much more aggressive and bluff more against their passive lines. It is usually only the first bet that is very +EV, but sometimes the second and third barrel is very +EV as well.

David Jimenez 8 years, 10 months ago

hahahaha I agree 100%. Why in the hell do I think that's good? I actually did shove lol
My thought process was to fold weaker aces and represent 2p+ but that doesn't make sense since he's not folding much of his aces, I mean me being villain I should be calling what? AT+? I'm not representing much really, you know they say when in doubt: fold? I didn't know what to do this turn since if I would have called and river would have bricked I would have had to fold and I didn't think that was good att. So my thought process I guess is kind of when in doubt: raise. For some reason

mattdonk 8 years, 10 months ago

Think you can still call the turn and fold river unimproved.

Also not sure even it is matters that much what we rep because peiple are terrible hands readers and in spot villan is likely already snapped the call button whatever because he's only got aQ+ and maybe even ak+

Getting people to fold top pair in 3bet pot after the barrel the turn is unlikely

Mercurius 8 years, 10 months ago

David,

You will see me as a little crazy but if you have a little time could you spend some minute on working on you for me.

I'm interested in what type of personnality make a natural good or bad poker player (and more generally what behaviour is good for what job or activity).
I think than most of our behavior are in fact made because of genetics. Science has show than some gene was defining some caracteristics of the big 5.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BigFivepersonality_traits.
If so many people do a lot of personal devellopement and never change it could be because they are made for what they are made.

I personnaly think than we can change but before we have to know for what we are do (geneticaly) and then decide if we are ok with that and make the change knowing than nature will always try to make you go back.
You can't change of road if you don't know where you go.

You seem to be a crazy raiser personnality.
From 0 to 10 how much would you rate yourself on the 5 traits of the big 5 ?

Mercurius 8 years, 10 months ago

lol

You have score yourself so the result can be biaised.
So by deontology I have to tell you than what I will say can be a little twisted.

Openess is correlated to intelligence so you probably are smart but lazy because of low conscientiousness. So you feel than you can but it never finish like you really want. This is problematic to grow up in a compagny because you should be the type of guy than start a lot things, have a lot of idea but never finish anything.
Because you will feel than you are not recognise at your correct value you will stop to work for other people. You probably have leave school soon because it was just not for you.

You seem to have the spirit of a beautiful girl, but you are not.
So you will soon be without work and money and will have to find a way to survive.

You put just average score on extravertion and agreableness.
It's sad because at first I think you could have been a famous artist
but you probably are average beautiful (5 on extravertion) so you will not be able to start a boys band.
And you probably don't like the contact of many people (5agreableness) so being on the center of a big stade with hundred of woman trowing their panty to you would have make you feel uncomfortable aniway.
So we have to find another thing.

You have to do something using your brain, but not to much, or by interval, without many people in your feet.

I really see you as an artist so maybee you can do painting, or writing.
Poete you shoud be poete, because they often have depression.
This is in accordance with your high neuroticism. Painting you may cut your hear and it's really painfull.

Man, this is your destiny your are done to go all sort of depravation place than you will find, casino, bar and whorehouse using all sort of alcool and drug to feel a lot of sensation and write great poeme.
You will have a melancholic (short) life and you will only be recognize after your death.

At one point you probably will have some mystic revelation. I can't really see what type of religion it will be but clearly something new wave. It will not be a sect because you can't have a master and structure, but something strange.

Isn't it nice ?

If you think I'm good, tell me, I will run buy a cristal ball and I will make money saying future.

David Jimenez 8 years, 10 months ago

you wrote that yourself?
must sound good, I like it
don't have talent for poetry though or I haven't been interested, I tried to study it once, emily dickinson is great
music production is what I'm interested, I feel I'm artist too, but who doesn't?

Mercurius 8 years, 10 months ago

you wrote that yourself?
Of course.
And it's scientificly garented.
If after your death you are not recognize I will really feel bad.

music production is what I'm interested
No, music is not for you. Show biz is for extraversion.
People doesn't have success for no reason.
They have because they are made for what they do and they work.

don't have talent for poetry though or I haven't been interested
Buy 2 or 3 book of poesy and try it. You will like it.
Mathematics tell me you are done for that.

David Jimenez 8 years, 10 months ago

Of course. And it's scientificly garented. If after your death you
are not recognize I will really feel bad

I'm sold
haha maybe I'll take your advice in reading some poetry
it can't hurt me

Lljag 8 years, 10 months ago

This is the bottom of your calling range so I think sometimes you can call or 3 bet bluff (it depends on UTG style and other people after us). Generally, I think EV(3bet)>EV(call). As played, call flop. OTT I d call or fold, depending on villains tendencies OTR (did he call a bet if we hit our flush ? Etc).

Bluffing when you rep very little combos is not a great play I think. So call or fold OTT.

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