Shoving in 3bet pot FD+SD
Posted by bumblebtuna
Posted by
bumblebtuna
posted in
Low Stakes
Shoving in 3bet pot FD+SD
WPN, $0.01/$0.02 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools by CardRunners - Hand Details
MP: $2 (100 bb)
CO: $2.72 (136 bb)
BTN: $2 (100 bb)
SB: $2.23 (111.5 bb)
Hero (BB): $3.44 (172 bb)
UTG: $2 (100 bb)
Preflop: Hero is BB with 9 8
UTG folds, MP raises to $0.06, 3 folds, Hero raises to $0.19, MP calls $0.13
Flop: ($0.39) 7 3
6
(2 players)
Hero bets $0.28, MP raises to $0.56, Hero raises to $3.25
Villain = 22/12
Pre Flop: I think the 3 bet was the wrong move here, thoughts?
Post Flop:
- Do people think 66-88 is in villains 3b calling range pre flop? Normally I put QQ-99 in their range until I see otherwise.
- Thoughts on shoving the flop? We have huge equity and villain is very unbalanced here...think I may have just answered this myself :D
Loading 6 Comments...
should check that board quite often, during the reason villain hits it(88,66,67). Our AA not getting 3 streets of value here mostly.
I would ch/call flop, and play other streets. Ch/raise is fine play too.
Other than that well played, 3 bet is totally good
Every time I try to write a response here I realize how much theory is actually involved in this hand. Some topics to consider here are how to balance flop betting ranges in 3bet pots (We have a relatively narrow range with very little fat value here, we have to be very meticulous to decide on a flop betting range and THEN consider how we defend when we get raised. That means calling freq. vs. shoving freq., I do not think it would be out of the question to say that we never 3bet the flop and only defend by calling, or never call and only raise). We also want to look at how check/raising or check/calling impacts the hand. An important idea is that we never want to take a hand that has a lot of equity and put it in a spot where we have to fold when raised.
For example, say MP here told the entire table that after the flop comes out his only raise size is all in. Would we want to be betting with 98hh here? Sure we might have the equity to call but were really not happy if he has a set, or if he has AThh suddenly we're in pain because he has a better flush draw and is blocking the ten.
So in the end, I really like the preflop 3bet with a hand like 98. Generally have good equity when called, can get lots of better hands to fold, not a big deal to toss away if we get 4bet, you know the deal. On the flop I think I prefer either betting and only defending raises by calling, or checking our entire range and deciding which hands to raise or call, if we want to raise any. Say we check then MP bets 15bb (leaving 75bb eff.), if we raise to 40bb and he shoves on us then it'll be 35bb to win 150? I don't even know what hands we could have that could find a fold there, so I'm not entirely convinced the raise is a great play. I'm feeling we should be bet/calling or check/calling only.
Interesting thoughts, I pretty much agree with everything you said. b/c is probably the line I should have taken.
The reason I raised was because of a number of things:
1. my cbet was pretty polarized, villain probably thinks i betting all my broadways as a bluff and all over pairs for value with some sets.
2. Based on point 1 I thought villain probably thinks this is a good board to raise as a bluff, as I'm weighted more towards air here.
3. By raising me, villain is very unbalanced/polarized, probably has sets, QQ and JJ, and air, and I think he has more air here than made hands.
4. By re-raising I can look like AA-QQ and can probably get him to fold JJ as well as better as all of their better air hands. If called then I have good equity.
5. Villains shoving range is a very small portion of his range, which makes the times I get shoved against vs the times he folds when I re-raise profitable.
However, I'm thinking this is 2nl and all of that probably won't be valid, and calling would have been that safer option, as villain could just do something very dumb.
You're definitely right about him.being able.to raise this flop a lot, his range does allow for that kuch better than ours. I think that's just more of a reason to call, like I'm not sure shoving QQ-AS over top of his raise is a great move on the flop so were not really telling those hands. They would just get folds from his air and calls from his sets.
This is really interesting to me though
Yeh as i was writing about "Looking like AA-QQ" I was thinking to a decent hand reader that probably would make sense. Good discussion!
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