Cold 4bet bvb - do we valuebet river?

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Cold 4bet bvb - do we valuebet river?

BN: $100.50
SB: $195.52 (Hero)
BB: $196.08
UTG: $437.98
HJ: $122.30
CO: $122.67
BTN is a reg playing 23/18. RFI on BTN: 44%, Fv3bet: 60% 600 hands
BB is a reg playing 21/17. 4bet: 3.7, Cbet flop: 60% W$WSF: 47, 2k hands
Preflop ($1.50) (6 Players)
Hero was dealt Q Q
UTG folds, HJ folds, CO folds, BN raises to $2, Hero raises to $7, BB raises to $21.49, BN folds, Hero calls $14.49
Flop ($46.48) T 5 4 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BB bets $22.48, Hero calls $22.48
Turn ($91.44) 8 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BB checks
River ($91.44) 3 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BB checks
Final Pot
Hero has Q Q Hero wins $87.14

I put BB a linear range pre, something like AKo-AJo, KQo, KQ-KJs, AKs-ATs, AA-TT. 

Do you prefer a small 5bet, a shove or a flat pre? Why?

As played can we valubet otr? For me it seems like BB is capped at A-high, K-high and JJ and at the time I thought that he wont call me with worse often enough. 


Thanks

8 Comments

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NoHubris 11 years, 1 month ago

I like the flat pre because you can get away from the hand when your opponent's range is strongly weighted towards AK and and ace or a king comes on the flop. Also, from my experience, when you get it in with queens preflop, you're usually looking at a flip against AK at best, although this could be different since it's button vs blind. The small 5 bet is terrible if you plan on folding to a shove, and I wouldn't expect you to be good very often if he 6bet shoves.

I would definitely value bet the river, something around $20-$35, to try and get called by AK, or maybe JJ if it's in your opponent's 4bet range. 

If he raised the river bet, I'd seriously consider folding, since I don't think he would bluff many hands in that spot, but I doubt he would raise very often. Otherwise, I think you played the hand fine.

ItsToothPasteISwear 11 years, 1 month ago

pre depends on a lot on your image, but for the most part I would just call, his 4 bet is really big for this spot so obviously hes aware of stack sizes, but with the button only being at 100bb, hes risking more with his 4 bet here than he would normally, so im more inclined to think its not a bluff as often sans any other kind of read.

I definitely think we should bet the river, its one of those spots that sucks cuz its so hard for us to get paid off by anything, but we just pretty much always have the best hand and hes so rarely going to bluff that we should be something. Even if we just make some retardedly small bet like $10, we at least give him the opportunity to call. There is some small value to checking tho, in that we get to see his hand, but I would still just bet something.


S0rry4Ddelay 11 years, 1 month ago

HI!!

If my opinion is allowed I think preflop you play the hand in the correct way, cause you want he keep rags in her range, I tried to get the range and its some like (TT+ AQs+, AKo, and maybe some random hands with some equity like suited conectors)

I think X-C flop and turn (i think thats the idea) is a great option cause if you raise just hands that beat you continues in the pot, in river Im agree with you, cause just AK or AQ calls you (maybe) and most of times you're betting for loose

GL in the tables!!

dyson 11 years, 1 month ago

A couple things..for one ur oop vs the 4bet that's y i like a small 5bet especially cuz its bvb... ur the one at a disadvantage but u have a strong hand....if he 6 bets then u asses when the time comes....if u take the route u took I dont mind a c/r otf...for one u have an overpair and for two hes BB w a random hand...if he flats ur c/r then u could b up against a set or kk aa....as for the check ott that's fine....I just feel like his cards r on their backs on the river he has ak aq aj 90% of the time the other 10% he has some weird underpair...I just say a little more aggression would've gotten u a little more value esp postflop....

Chael Sonnen 11 years, 1 month ago

Flatting the 4-bet pre-flop is the onyl reasonable play to make. A reggy BB will not put in 200BB after you 3-bet the BTN with less than QQ.

You're not going to make much money on the river either way, but a bet is likely best.
He would have most overpairs on the turn, so he has to call you with something like AT/KT pre-flop cold 4-bet bluffs, or hero call AK.

Your hand looks like Tx, some JJ/QQ/AK/AQ, so you barely have any bluffs. Maybe QJhh or something.
Because you have few bluffs, I think you should make a small bet to allow him to bluff catch with weaker one pairs.

Something like 44 seems fine.

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