A different type of leak (colour coding & note taking)
Posted by bdon22
Posted by
bdon22
posted in
Low Stakes
A different type of leak (colour coding & note taking)
Recently I have noticed a new type of leak in my game. I am misplaying hands because my notes and colour coding are not consistent with my HUD stats of a player. On top of that, I tend to take notes of specific hands. Sometimes, especially with regulars, my notes field becomes extremely cluttered and it becomes impossible to decipher when I'm in a hand without timing out.
Example HH -- http://weaktight.com/6281190
In this hand I have villain tagged as a loose aggressive/spewy regular (dark blue). I believed he would have CR'ed a set on this flop, especially deep, to build a pot. It's possible he peeled with 99 and now has a boat. But there are only 3 combos of the 99 boat and none of the other boats or quads make sense to me given his line. Since his range is so narrow, and I have him labelled as a LAG/spewtard, I think it's a call. I'm not going to waste any effort trying to think of all the hands he turns into bluffs here.
On the other hand, his stats are 21/16 with a 3-bet of 7.5% and fold to 3-bet of 63%. Fold flop cbet 30%, fold turn 40%. Flop cbet 80%, turn cbet 40%. WWSF 45%, WTSD 20% over 1.2k hands. These stats are inconsistent with my colour coding labelling him as a LAG/spewy player.
On top of this, here are what my notes read of him:
3BL A5o 1B w/ BDNFD ch down missed equity
3BL (sqz) KTo 1B w/ BP+gs on AJT 5/1
cbet 66 1B on Q43tt 3way IP
flat 3B 98s ch down pair+gs
ch river w/ nut straight (CR?) 4-straight
small bets =w in 3B pot 3-way 1B K63tt
thin value w/ TPGK KJo on 3-flush/paired (turn ch) 4/6
no cbet medium SD value eg TPMK ATo in 3B pot
As you can see, if I had all the time in the world, I would have been able to decipher from my notes that he's really only "LAGgy" pre-flop, 3-betting some marginal hands with blockers in them. And in most cases, he shuts down after firing 1 bullet on the flop and is passive with his SD value hands (therefore not turning them into bluffs). Totally consistent with his flop/turn cbet of 80%/40%. But in the heat of the moment, with 3 other tables flashing at me, these notes might as well be hieroglyphics. The quantity of notes is high, but the quality is poor.
Villain's pre-flop 3-betting image fooled me into thinking that he plays post-flop in a similar fashion. I incorrectly labelled him as a "LAG" player and thus he completely owned me in this HH.
I've realized that it's not my deductive reasoning that's necessarily busted or a leak. It's my process that is causing me to make decisions based on incorrect assumptions and unusable evidence.
Colour Coding Systems
Do any of you use colour coding systems? If so, how specific are your colour codes? Have you ever experienced the same issue as me where your colour coding is not consistent with villain's actual play?
My system is as follows:
Green - Default bad player. Saw them limp or do something otherwise fishy. It can be as little as one hand where they open limped and had < 100BB stack so I instantly label them as green.
Light Green - Calling station. Peels multiple streets post-flop with weaker than top pair. Chases draws and gutshots for big size bets.
Light Blue - Aggressive bad player. Will often donk bet with air or turn weak made hands into bluffs. The type of player to open shove 40BB's with 66 UTG, or overbet shove the flop with 2nd pair in 3-bet pot. The problem is sometimes these are green players on tilt, and actually have rather passive HUD stats. Or on other days, they seem to play more calmed down. Then the light blue colour tag completely messes up my reads.
Yellow - 100BB stack player that I need to take a note on, but still insufficient hands to determine if he's a full on "regular" or just a fish sitting with 100BB+
Purple - Default regular. Usually I can tell right away by their bet sizing and if they are positionally aware, taking into account all the other players at the table such as short stackers or fish.
Orange - Weak tight regular. Often nitty players that only bet with TPGK or better. They never bet thin for value and rarely bluff. The problem is there are some players who I label orange but aren't really nits. They will surprise me by bluff raising me or semi-bluffing well. Often the guys from Korea fall into this category for some reason. Sometimes I make the mistake of equating pre-flop tightness to post-flop.
Red - Strong regular that I know is a big winner and/or I have important history with. I generally try to avoid playing against these guys unless I'm on my A-game, have good cards, or in position.
Pink - Any type of 40BB short stacker.
Dark Blue - Overly aggressive regular. Not the same as light blue because they are more dangerous and difficult to play against (mostly because 100BB). Sometimes I mistakenly label a player dark blue when really they are purple. I'm sure I fall into this category myself when I am tilting or playing bad.
It's funny that just writing that out helped me realize a what's wrong with my colour coding system. Colour coding is supposed to allow my subconscious brain to instantly develop a strategy against that type of player. However some of my colour codes may be a little overly specific, causing my strategy to become overdeveloped. I almost never make a mis-read playing against a Green or Purple. In close spots, I always revert to my HUD stats or notes. But sometimes against a Dark Blue or Orange player, I will call or fold too easily without considering my HUD.
Basically, I have too many colour codes. My colour coding system was developed before I started using a HUD. So it's a bit obsolete, and I should probably consider dropping the colours that cause me to make the most mistakes. In reality, people tilt, and it would be a huge mistake to think that they play that way all the time.
Note Taking
Even though I play 4-tables of Rush poker I'm always taking tons of notes. The right notes can make all the difference. Especially when it's information that's not readily available in my HUD. Common ones are bet sizing tells, timing tells, the type of hands they are donk betting or check/raising with, etc.
The problem is, I take too many notes. On top of the useful ones I mentioned above, I'm taking notes redundant with my HUD stats. Of course he's playing "any ace / any 2 suited" his VPIP is 40! Of course he only fires 1 bullet, his flop c-bet is 70% but his turn cbet is 30%!
Sometimes I'm basically writing down the entire HH! Here are some real examples:
CR flopped 2 pair, barrel turn (overcard) shutdown river 4straight
3B w/ 99 vs. BTN cbet 1B on Axx
These notes take up so much real-estate in my note box yet they don't really tell me anything useful. All they will serve to do is confuse me when I'm in a big hand trying to make an important decision.
I've realized that using key words is huge. Also separating streets or whether it's a 3-bet or 4-bet pot helps too. Notes that imply a strategy using very few words is the best.
Honest in 3-bet pots
No bluff missed draw
Creates dead money
Passive with set
What are some of the notes you guys like to take? What strategies do they imply?
Now I'm going to have to spend a long time re-formatting and deleting all my notes! But it's for the better.
This post started off as more of a question leading into a discussion for the more experienced players. But the more time I spent writing it and analyzing my process, the more questions I seemed to answer on my own. So maybe it can be a bit of a strategy post too, since this is the SSNL forum :)
TL;DR - Colour coding should allow you to paint a general picture of the type of strategy to enter the hand with and nothing more. Note taking should be for strategic advice not contained in the HUD, using keywords and taking up as little space as possible.
Loading 6 Comments...
My personal setup in Colour Coding System is to mark, in a big sample size, those regs with a nice EV/100BB ratio, another colour for those slightly winners/breakeven players and another one for those who are -X EV/100BB. I do often mark those reg-fish if they are not losing a lot and those who are burning money (again, a big sample size). I do not want to to use colour tag for any specific tendencies or to indicate something you can check on your HUD at a glance. I used to mark specific tendencies preflop with different colours but I realised that I was playing so much tight/loose vs them. So you can think that dividing different players depending on their EV/100 may condition me as much as the previous system, and it probably does, but it helps me to see how better players than me play and observe how they act, specially postflop.
On note taking I do not go crazy with them. I use to wite down any unusual hand or move, specially if I am able to see his holding. Not to say "he is always 4betting garbage from the blinds" but to realise that he can deviate from the "standard way". And on generic note taking I do not want to be so much generic. In your example, for instance, you say Passive with set. Does it meas always? Or just Dry boards? Drawy Boards? Flush Draw boards? STRD Boards? OTF? OTT?
So this is my procedure, maybe I am going wrong with all this. I think your idea is nice: we can share our ideas and discover our own weaknesses.
Nice post
Regards
I just spent tonight fixing my colour coding and so far so good. New colour codes:
So far so good. Only played for 2 hours today but I felt like I was being more rational by looking at the HUD more.
I also added a line to my HUD. Stats I'm showing now are:
I added the DonkBet stat just for the hell of it but I noticed it's very useful. For example lots of fish like to donkbet and it's great to know if they do it 10% of the time or 50% of the time.
How about introducing a color code for nits and lags? How do yellow vs. purple vs. red players affect your decisions? I think these categories may be too specific. Maybe reg and tough reg would be enough.
I originally had a colour system for nits and lags. But I would notice nits bluffing me and lags having the goods more often than not. My colour coding was biasing my decision TOO much in these cases.
But you might be right on my reg system having too much resolution.
have your notes, but include general strat notes at the top - those are the ones you can refer to quickly. colour coding is great, i think you have a good system in place.
something can be said about having too much information and too much going on at once. i've been guilty of this.
my HUD contains fewer stats now but those that i do have converge quickly and so are more relevant.
+1 on putting the general impressions at the top. I usually take individual hand notes first until there's enough to draw a conclusion, then I clean up the notes by putting the conclusion at the top and saving only some of the examples below.
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