4Bet Bluff or Value? 50NL Zoom 6Max
Posted by CombatCarl
Posted by
CombatCarl
posted in
Low Stakes
4Bet Bluff or Value? 50NL Zoom 6Max
BN: $75.88
SB: $51.50
BB: $50.75
UTG: $111.41 (Hero)
HJ: $49.25
CO: $95.19
SB: $51.50
BB: $50.75
UTG: $111.41 (Hero)
HJ: $49.25
CO: $95.19
Preflop
($0.75)
(6 Players)
Hero was dealt
J
K
Hero raises to $1.50, HJ folds, CO raises to $5.50, BN folds, SB folds, BB folds, Hero raises to $12.50, CO calls $7
Hero raises to $1.50, HJ folds, CO raises to $5.50, BN folds, SB folds, BB folds, Hero raises to $12.50, CO calls $7
Flop
($27.25)
Q
A
7
(2 Players)
Hero bets $13.52
He is 26/25/af1.3/3bet15.4 BTN 3bet 12.5 (8) 66 hands
Thoughts?
Loading 16 Comments...
I don't really like the 4bet preflop, even if he seems to be 3betting light. You're OOP and dominated very often (KQ, AK, AJ) against his calling range.
Even though the flop hits his range very well, I think semi-bluffing (like you did) was the best play. Your sizing is great for a blocking bet, since any smaller bet could trigger a small raise from a lot of weird hands (A10/KQ-ish), and you can't very well defend against those.
I'm working on UTG 4bet bluff range deep but this hand might not apply since he could be wide pre.
As for the flop size, I went half pot which is on the big side for the reasons you mentioned.
Makes sense. I wasn't sure what you were going with pre.
i'll call and i'll fold sometimes pf, but never 4betting here.
So, you don't ever 4bet bluff deep from UTG? Or, could it be that 200BB ESS is not deep enough?
sorry, i meant this particular hand.
I rather have this hand to protect my check calling range OTF. That are very few rundowns that are bad for us and we can represent by checking, a medium strength hand like: KQ, KK, JJ on this board. Also, we have the nut non pair hand on this board and a plenty of equity against an ace.
I don't hate the 4b against a 16% 3bettor but you have a small sample and if you choose to 4b bluff AQ/KQ would be much better candidates to do it. Also, suited hands have a little less blocking value than offsuit hands. I think his range is pair heavy, 66-JJ and some AKo, AQs. This hands would barrel very often and if you get raised OTF by like AQ is terrible for the huge equity our have against his range.
Hmmmmm, now that's a very interesting input there. Thanks. I was thinking more like KTo/KJo for 4bet/bluff range but I guess AQo/KQo makes sense too.
there's no reason to turn this hand into a bluff with a 4b. calling >>>> 4bet imo
Regarding your stack size I think you should 4bet larger or just fold. With this price plus the implied odds and position I'm defending with my entire 3betting range here. It creates too good of a spot for CO to 5bet light, or, if he's calling, his range either got you dominated or play well against you in position. There's nothing you can do with both of you are deep and he's got relative position on you, it is part of the game when good opponents take advantage of you under this kind of situation, and at the end of the day, KJs does belong to the bottom of the UTG opening range.
you are lighting money on fire with a 4b/fold strategy here. this hand is plenty good to just call the 3bet.
You mean because he is supposedly wide pre right? Flatting the 3bet vs a tight range is -EV, I think.
i agree, against a tight range it make a call less attractive and on that same note, a 4bet still -ev.
we only have 66 hands so i'm not putting too much stock into this guys 13 3b, but i'm also not thinking he has a nit 3bet range here. call and play some post flop.
Are people here more likely to call KJs because we are deep? A few of my friends I've discussed this with increase their calling ranges but I can't get them to justify it other than 'we can't fold this deep'.
Personally I'm more inclined to fold this deep as the power of position will be that much more important 200bb deep unless we have a significant skill advantage (at 66 hand sample we probably can't be sure).
What does everyone else think?
I think that the 3bet size should be bigger pre even in position when deep to compensate for a reasonable calling range since it seems pretty elastic. As for the initial raiser putting in the 4bet, it simply allows us to keep the initiative where we can apply more pressure on the opponent postflop by taking different lines. In this hand, I lead big and he tanks 20 seconds to fold because it is a difficult decision for him to float or raise because a bomb could be coming somewhere thereafter. Like, if he raises me on flop then I was gonna shove on him and see how he likes it.
As for flatting the 3bet wide pre simply because we are deep probably is not as +EV as people often speculate so I agree with you there. I like to flat when someone 3bets small because I think that it's a sign that it's likely a weak player especially if they don't know when to fold. Here is a hand from the same session and this is exactly what I'm talking about.
ugh, I have no clue about this hand. Cool post
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