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25-50 A bad situation

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Posted by posted in High Stakes

25-50 A bad situation

Blinds: $25.00/$50.00 (4 Players) CO: $5050.00
BN: $5000.00 (Hero)
SB: $5025.00
BB: $1750.00
Preflop ($75.00) Hero is BN with 7 A
CO folds, Hero raises to $100.00, SB raises to $400.00, BB folds, Hero calls $300.00
Flop ($850.00) A T J
SB checks, Hero checks
Turn ($850.00) A T J 3
SB checks, Hero bets $450.00, SB calls $450.00
River ($1750.00) A T J 3 3
SB checks, Hero bets $1312.50, SB raises to $4175.00 and is all in, Hero folds
Final Pot SB wins $4373.00
Rake is $2.00

Opponent with a good reg.
I want to defend my flop check range (Jx Tx) some aces . I think for many people it is standard.
The turn bet for value vs KK QQ KJ QJ KT QT,
just on the turn we have some hands with which we want to bluff : fd (87,86 etc) 45.

On the river, I'm doing a big bet , because opponent range capped in my eyes.
And we still can get some value from middle pair, but villian goes all-in, i think that our opponent understands our range after the check-check flop does not contain many hands that are ahead Ax(AQ AT AJ KQ JT - all these hands we bet on flop).
The only hands that ahead of Ax its 33&A3s= 3 combinations. Opponent may have here AA KQ.
I think opponent can quite safely go all - in with any Ax and print a lot of money against my strategy.

How can we counter this ?:
---Bet flop with weak Ax?
---Check the flop with some KQ?
---Check flop with some AQ AJ AT?
---Does not bet river with Ax?
---Call with a weak Aces on the river , despite the fact that in the best case we will share bank?
---Something else ?

Tnx for your answers, and sorry for my terrible english ;)

13 Comments

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Disharmonist 10 years, 1 month ago

How to counter that:
Option 1: Fold pre. What are you trying to accomplish by calling with a weak ace that a) has to hit to be playable b) wont win you much money when you do hit top pair or a seven.
Option 2: 4-bet pre, fold to shove. Maximum pressure, while maintaining FEQ and making the hand play easily.
Option 3: Bet your entire range on the flop like you were floating with 76 dd.
Option 4: Leave the table and dont try to be a hero against an opponent who seems to outplay you.

Conclusion: Make decisions as easy as they can be and dont try to balance calling ranges because you lose all your value and all your fold equity if you do so.

blackwater 10 years, 1 month ago

check back turn.

on river, without you betting the turn, he can't rely on you betting/barreling the river so he's going to be more inclined to bet his slow played hands, weak pairs, and bluffs. The times he's not bluffing, the pot is controlled so you're not losing much.

superbad 10 years ago

I think you have to play a 1 street game here checking turn is def an option but as played I would just take a showdown and xb river.

Live_your_dreams85 10 years ago

All good advice..
diff just playing a 1 street game here.

Also I think the comment that villain is cap here is not entirely accurate.. Villain could construct his OOP Range VS BTN to have alot of strong hands that he check's to us..
One reason for this dynamic is the fact that he assumes your range to be bluff/ thin value heavy
and that he can gain more money checking his value range to you then leading with it..
There is a good chance the has his this board hard and blocks you from having many value combos on it..

sweet16 10 years ago

33 is one combo actually and A3hh is the only suited one possible, a bit picky but just sayin. However interesting spot, depending on how villains range looks.. Can't this be a bluff catcher worth considering since we don't block any broad way cards that can turn into a bluff like KJ, QJ, KK, QQ type of hands or whatever he might show up with here when he's bluffing, no? I feel however these stakes is a bit too high for me.. So no clue how these games play etc. If this isn't a good bluff catcher, what type of hands do we want to bluff catch with? I think I would want to bet smaller so we don't have to defend as much when he raises. We are not repping a super strong range either so smaller size makes some sense to me.

angeles 10 years ago

depends on what exploitative factors we wanna take into a account.

Generally speaking I think everything is fine up until the river which is somewhat close. If you're planning to follow through with most of your bluff combos this is clearly a value bet and likely a bet/call with some frequency. Its good youre not blocking any part of his bluffing range which would lean me towards the call column (more often then not) without more substantial information.

klamsauce 10 years ago

I just feel like if villain is going to potentially turn his range into a bluff against our thin value bet and not call, then we shouldn't thinly value bet unless we plan to induce and call it off. It's just that simple. There's no value in it and we get outplayed. I'd either check the turn back and bet the river or just bet the turn and check down. If we have reads we can play the river a lot better imo.

For us to call it off on the river we are forced to make a lot of assumptions about our opponent and since our assumptions to actually bet the river were probably incorrect in hindsight, we are more or less guessing now. In the future I just feel like it's better to bet one street with this hand bc it's worth one street, and deviate from that when we have reads to make more optimal/profitable decisions.

UpUpAndAway 10 years ago

If hero thinks the river value bet is thin but profitable and therefore bets resulting in a checkraise from villain, it still doesn't make the bet a bad or unprofitable bet in the long run just because he get's checkraised this time.

There's no way for hero to tell, before betting river, if villain is going to checkraise jam for value, checkraise jam as a bluff, or check/call with a worse hand.

If hero knows more about villain's river tendencies and falls into this trap over and over again then his play should move into the incorrect category but it seems wrong to me to not bet a river that's close but possibly profitable because a checkraise would put hero in an uncomfortable spot.

Sauce123 10 years ago

FMW,

It's very good that you recognize the vulnerabilities of your strategy.

You can't go back in time and slowplay flop more, so now you've got a range mostly capped at Ax. You can now pick a call frequency. If you just hate the situation, you can fold range here and either play Ax slower next time or mix in some slowplays. Otherwise, it's fine to just click a button here, but I'd shy away from outlier strategies like 'call always' or 'fold always' because you allow yourself to lose a lot against an exploitative opponent. I think a fine strategy is to just call around a third of the time here if you're very unsure.

shibulon 10 years ago

What would you suggest doing with our bluffs that check back flop if we choose to play Ax slower?

Rapha Nogueira 10 years ago

Against his range you don't have two streets of value. He is certainly calling once with KK/QQ/KJs/KTs and folding to another barrel, specially one that is this large that leads to a lower defense frequency.

If you are betting AT/AJ/JT when checked to OTF your river range is too weak to fire with this sizing and you can certainly get exploited by him turning hands into a bluff.

thereheis 10 years ago

good post and good thoughts.

I don't really have a hard solution but I definitely disagree with a turn check. he should have few AK/AQ, but lots of hands worse than yours that you don't want to give a free card like KQ KJ QJ. it's also nice to get a bet in vs. a hand like A5s.

my hunch is that you should go smaller on the river. I think your objective should be to put hands like KK, QQ, Jx, Tx in a tough spot rather than potentially fold out other Ax.

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