10/20 150bb NFD
Posted by sxz18
Posted by
sxz18
posted in
High Stakes
10/20 150bb NFD
I find this to be an awkward spot that comes up often enough to warrant some discussion. Here is the hand:
Effective stacks ~3000
Hero raises to $60 UTG Ah8h
BB calls
Flop Tx 2h 3h
BB checks, Hero bets $85, BB raises to $230, Hero raises to $685.
What is the plan if BB calls? If BB ships? Does your action change if flop is Th 2h 3x instead? Is my raise size too small?
Generally I feel like calling the raise puts you in a spot where you need to hit to win because all future streets become more difficult to bluff once you call. Granted if stacks go in the middle you are either up against a set or a combo flush draw like 54hh, you at least gain equity from having all draws dominated.
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I feel like this is just one of those flops that people don't mess around on simply b/c they can't rep anything credible. Additionally, your equity when you get it in is probably on the 35-40% side more often than not. I feel like I'd lean towards the range play and call the ch/r, planning to call turns and decide on rivers. Also your sizing seems way too big.
If he calls, I'd bet/call turns that are good for you and most likely check back to realize/bluff catch. I feel like your in a WA/WB spot(that sounds so 2008) when he calls your 3bet so letting him realize his equity with his dominated draws is better for you than bet/calling turn and getting it in on the 20% side.
What to do if he shoves seems obvious.
Well he should have more TXhh combos than 3Xhh so yeah I'd be less inclined to 3b get it in on Tx 2h 3h than Th 2h 3x.
I dont see a reason for a 3bet here, unless you think that he would CR TxJx+ (without FD) here alot and might fold that to a 3bet. I think that is the keypoint here.
The Other parts of his range are a classic WA/WB situation where a calldown has much more value with Ahi.
So what is you assumption on his JxTx+ (no fd) CR freq.?
Overbet, if we were taking the 3b route what sizing would you suggest?
RedWhite, I believe he is check raising most pairs on this flop, some draws, and an occasional bluff.
--
The reason I chose the 3b route (even though I'm
still unsure if it's correct) is because it blends my range the best on
this type of flop. I should mention that up to this point I was playing
hyper aggressive due to reads but also due to
a nice run of cards. Do we agree that 3 betting this flop gets our
opponent to fold all but the top of his range? If so, wouldn't our play
be dictated on how often we perceive Villain to be check raising sets
here?
My assumption is although this flop is difficult to
check raise, it's also dry enough where you can check raise any pair and
most draws and get your opponent to fold specifically because your
perceived range is so slim. If opponents are
playing cautiously against a check raise on this flop then it seems
reasonable to expand your check raise range if we were Villain to
include the top 70% or so of our range.
Thoughts?
--
Continuing with the hand, opponent calls the 3bet and we will throw out a few possible turn cards.
Kx, Th, Ax, 8x
Our opponent checks. Pot is $1500 and effective
stacks are $1255. What is our action given each of these turn cards and
sizing if action is something other than shipping? FWIW I don't believe
all four of these cards dictate a shove on the
turn.
Well, I'm too lazy to count stack sizes, but if we want to 3bet, ideally we'd size to where we can either jam turn or bet turn small, jam river. Both seem OK.
>>>>>The reason I chose the 3b route (even though I'm still unsure if it's correct) is because it blends my range the best on this type of flop. I should mention that up to this point I was playing hyper aggressive due to reads but also due toa nice run of cards. Do we agree that 3 betting this flop gets our opponent to fold all but the top of his range? If so, wouldn't our play be dictated on how often we perceive Villain to be check raising sets here? My assumption is although this flop is difficult to check raise, it's also dry enough where you can check raise any pair and most draws and get your opponent to fold specifically because your perceived range is so slim. If opponents areplaying cautiously against a check raise on this flop then it seems reasonable to expand your check raise range if we were Villain to include the top 70% or so of our range.Thoughts?<<<<
While ch/ring stuff like A3 and barreling off might be a good vacuum play for villain, doing it to the extent your mentioning here seems incredibly easy to catch on to and exploit. So, I dunno, I just don't see people ch/r'ing AT for value and then doing a complete 180 and folding it when you decide to 3bet. It seems like ch/r ranges are much more polarized and against that type of range, calling with your continuing range seems to make the most sense from an overall strategy perspective.
That being said, if you wanted to have a 3bet range in this spot, this hand seems like one of the better ones to do it with.
Any input on the four different turn cards anybody?
Commenting on 4 different turns is going to be a difficult conversation to have on a forum. It's best to stick to one narrow topic for sake of a good arguememt
i dunno, 150bb deep this is a slam dunk call for me on the flop not a 3 bet. you can call any turn and plenty of implied odds when you hit and he may keep bluffing on flush runouts and give up when flush misses
"The reason I chose the 3b route (even though I'm still unsure if it's correct) is because it blends my range the best on this type of flop."
o rly.
You do want to have a 3bet range here vs someone who is c/ring too much. This is one of the last hands I would consider doing it w/ at 150bb. 80bb or 400bb sure.
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