100NL: KK facing a c/r on a dry board
Posted by TheChosenOne
Posted by
TheChosenOne
posted in
Low Stakes
100NL: KK facing a c/r on a dry board
BN: $100.50
SB: $114.86
BB: $98.99
UTG: $100
HJ: $101.97 (Hero)
CO: $112.74
SB: $114.86
BB: $98.99
UTG: $100
HJ: $101.97 (Hero)
CO: $112.74
BTN: 23/18/6
BB: no hands (likely weaker player because of not full buy in)
BB: no hands (likely weaker player because of not full buy in)
Preflop
($1.50)
(6 Players)
Hero was dealt
K
K
UTG folds, Hero raises to $3, CO folds, BN calls $3, SB folds, BB calls $2
UTG folds, Hero raises to $3, CO folds, BN calls $3, SB folds, BB calls $2
Flop
($9.50)
7
4
2
(3 Players)
BB checks,
Hero bets $6.50,
BN calls $6.50,
BB raises to $22,
Hero calls $15.50,
BN folds
Not sure what he's doing this with, but I think KK is strong enough to call.
Turn
($60.00)
7
4
2
9
(2 Players)
BB bets $33,
Hero folds
I think my options are to go with the hand by calling turn and river, or folding now. I think villain can have 2 pair, sets, 65s, maybe some random heart draws?
What do you think?
What do you think?
Final Pot
BB
wins $57.30
Loading 15 Comments...
dont see many 2 pair hands in his range...... i dont fold turn
77,44,22,74s I think he can have for value. Call turn, call most rivers?
I think if we are calling the flop we shouldnt be folding this turn. He c/r a real size on a dry flop, I think if we are calling we think its because hes bad and overplaying a hand like TP or has stuff like TT and what not. This turn really doesnt help his range at all except for 99, and I dont think his betting changes anything because if hes going to play A7 or TT like this on the flop or c/r bluff 2 people on the driest board possible hes just going to keep betting this turn.
I'm not sure how bad he is or overplaying TP. But are you suggesting we can sometimes fold flop here? I know this turn doesn't help him much, but I'd figure some of his bluffs should give up now, so his betting range becomes stronger.
I dont think he has many pure bluffs, and if he did I dont expect them to fold, I mean hes trying to rep a set, and when people try to do that they dont give up on the turn in my experience.
This is really player dependent, so it sucks that you don't have any reads.
He's repping sets and maybe 74s, because you opened the HJ and c-bet 3-way, but I don't think you should fold versus a reasonable c/r range.
His range probably looks like 56s, 68s, 63s, overs with backdoor FD, A3s/A5s and 77/44/22.
A lot of his semi-bluffs can continue on this 9, so I think you should call again. you're getting 3:1, and you only lose to 9 combos, 13 at the most.
If you call, how do you play rivers? I think I would need to call a lot of rivers, but I'm not happy about it.
TheChosenOne:if you call flop and turn you must call always river
Interesting spot
Villain either is capable of bluff raising this board texture into 2 players or he has value ONLY so:
On the flop you either cbet/fold or call the raise and call turn depending on his player type. Some villains are ONLY raising here with a hand that beats us when UTG cbets and BTN calls. Others will see it as a good spot to represent something, although the BTN can definitely be strong here.
On the river i would be happy seeing the board pairing. 8/3 would be quite bad and the 6/5 complete some gutshots that turned OESD or remained GSSDs
I really don't see why villain should be X/R'ing sets or something here. There's really not much of a raising range on such a board texture, although I could see some people doing it as a level since the general line on these boards are X/C, with a X/R on the turn.
But, this player does look weaker, especially buying in for less than 100bb's. We don't know anything about them either, so it's not the nicest of spots. For all we know though, this villain could be aggressive enough to X/R TT on this flop since recreational players will often be thinking "ZOMG OVERPAIR" rather than thinking about the range hero will continue with, and the relative strength of a small overpair compared to that range.
It's one of those spots where I honestly think you could swing either way. I think you could flat-out fold the flop, or call down on any decent run-out (the 9 isn't too scary, only improve 97s and 99). Pretty tough spot since we're readless, so I'd make my decision based on my gambling mood for the day. I'm not feeling THAT confident when I call three streets though. Definitely one of those spots where reads would help. For all we know, Villain could be buying in with the rest of his roll and trying to gambool it up, so yeah.
I don't like the turn fold after the flop call though, to be honest.
seems like a pretty standard call.. just saying. 4:1 on the flop, weaker turn bet instead of jamming. a lot of things about this convince me he has a low value 7x a lot or semibluff.
Never folding to this guy on the turn.
fish dont semibluff most of the time so he s got set or overplayed top pair or overpair. readless i would fold flop and wait for better spot to get his stack. i dont want to play a guessing game vs fish which ch/r flop vs 3 players
This statement doesn't make much sense. To say our opponent is never semi-bluffing because he didn't buy-in for full/autofill is a pretty big statement with no info. It's not necessarily a guessing game, it's more of filling in the blanks of his range.
The thing is he doesn't really represent a lot. Yes, he can have sets, 2p, but the combinations of these are a little more limited. Yes he calls with pps, which a set is in his range for doing this. With 4:1 with an overpair though, I don't think I'm ever folding because he does this with a lot more 7x's then a set. The thing is, if he does raise here - he has more 7x's & semi-bluffing hands in his range then sets & 2p. Which leads me to why I'm calling this turn, if he barrels the river, we're never folding. I'd assume he's going to c/r with 7x here for a lot of reasons & barrel this turn for some obvious reasons. If we could conclude his range to only c/ring 2pair+ on this board, this would be a fold. With no info, it's a call. If he jams this turn, I'd consider folding more here. That being said we are getting pretty good odds on our money, whether were ahead/behind is going to be based upon our opponents range for c/ring the flop, (which we have no info on)but I think in a vaccum a call is pretty standard.
dynosar already mentioned an interesting point here: sizings....IF ppl XR decent vs more than 1 player and then bet about half pot HU OTT they´re usually givin out Info...
I agree to most said here that i could usually not find the fold button OTF (even though im not sure if this is a mistake tbh)
But in my expirience this gap between sizing is often meant for pure value due to the fact that there is OTF still more players that can call -> and so a little more raise for protection/vaule with a set vs wheels and 56 ( as an example).
OTT and then HU he often just wants to keep the 1 customer (protection gets way less important here) and bets very small.
Just assumptions and i see me fish calling OTT again in play. But IMO his sizings just scream strenght in hindsight
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