Moving abroad for poker
Posted by Chael Sonnen
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Chael Sonnen
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Moving abroad for poker
Hey guys,
I've decided that I want to move abroad next year. To start playing poker fulltime, in a place where I can enjoy myself, and not have to worry about huge taxes.
Now I'm looking for some places to move to.
Requirements:
Safety - I'm not interested in going to places where you can't get off the resort, can't go to certain areas etc. Mexico comes to mind. Only safe places where I don't have to be worried about anything
Good weather all year - Looking for a warm environment, though preferably nothing too extreme.
No taxes - Don't want to deal with paying them, and having to keep track of everything. I happily donate money to charity to make up for it.
Other poker friends - Hopefully, I can find a house to live in with other poker players, or something like an apartment complex
No underdeveloped countries - It's important that's there's proper food and water, and places to go do stuff.
Locations I've come up with:
Mexico
Malta
Thailand
If poker were legalised, I'd add the US to the list
let's hear some suggestions!
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Come join me in Canada :)
Wait just saw the good weather requirement. NEVERMIND!
Snowboarding is awesome though :(
You just described heaven but we are on earth. If you find ever a country that fits into this, just put here! By the away, Brazil is awesome but I dont think it fits some things that you want.
Brazil is way too violent to live in.
I am not sure if Mexico is a lot better. I moved this year to Rio de Janeiro, in a neighbourhood near the famous beaches of Ipanema-Copacabana. I never really felt so safe in my life, actually. I have traveled a bunch and I can say that probably only NYC is good as Rio and you can find some easy live games here, but not high stakes, which is sad. But for a online pro I can not see a better place to live. On the 1k~2k rent neighbourhoods I can say that anyone is reasonably safe.
Sao Paulo is way more expensive than other cities but I moved from a smaller town to Rio de Janeiro and decreased my living cost. There is so many great places to buy food and stuff that if you search right, can find good prices.
I never been to Porto Alegre, it is too far from Sao Paulo-Rio de Janeiro and dont have that many things to see on spending a vacation. A friend of mine lives there and loves it, but I think it gets a little too out of scene in Brazil being so far from the great northeast beaches and SP-RJ. It is way cheaper than Sao Paulo and Rio.
I'm very interested to see if someone has a location that meets all these criteria
If you learn to like the snow there are a lot of beautiful places to live in (not just Canada).
I love snow and wintersports etc., but not all year long.
A lot of pros live in Vancouver. The winters aren't nearly as harsh as Toronto. But it rains a lot there.
Mexico, Belize, Australia (much more expensive), Nicaragua. Safety is way less of a problem than you think it is.
Im from Mexico, and there are many safe places I would like also to move to play when I earn more on poker, like the zones of Riviera Maya, Riviera Nayarit, some towns in Queretaro and Guanajuato, and Baja California Sur.
If you want to live in big cities like DF (where Im studying), Guadalajara, Morelia and Cuernavaca you have to be cautious about not going out at night on some places, but in DF (AKA Mexico City, the capital) you can find everything and some safe places in Coyoacan and Condesa Zone.
Feel free to PM if you want to know anything else :)
It would have to be in a resort type thing close to the beach, where it's 100% safe.
Malta seems popular, and I haven't seen it mentioned yet. NOt sure what the tax situation is there admittedly.
It's also in the EU, which might make visiting home/having friends visit more reliable!
There's a thread on 2p2 where 2 brothers are living in Cambodia on $30 per week each or something ridiculous inclusive of nights out! So you can probably live like a King there. :)
EDIT: I have seen Malta is mentioned now.
BsAs is awesome. Have been there couple of times.. the problem is the country is really deep in inflation and some economic trouble that I think it is a real risk to move there nowadays.
It's tax free, from what I've heard. Lots of poker players there.
Not interested in Cambodia. :)
Re BsAs, a close friend owns a charitable Football community called FC Bafa. It's basically a social thing where people meet and play football/eat/drink beer...
It sounds fun, he feels safe.
He's mentioned something about the economy and that banks aren't the best, but poker players can circumvent that I bet with various e-wallets.
Also, from what i recall there is a real premium for $$$ currency, so that might solve your problem from last week! ;-)
I'd choose a place in England -even though you'd have to skip on the weather thing...
Nah, I prefer good weather. Malta seems perfect.
Australia solid choice , Malta prob second best. Colombia could be a potential third
Nah, I'm not into finding snakes and spiders in my bed.
I am Brazilian and Daniel Coleman aka "mrGR33N13" lives here, more specifically in Rio de Janeiro where fellow RIO member Raphael Nogueira lives. Safety here is underestimated a TON by foreigners, you will find violence EVERYWHERE if you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. There are violent areas in Brazil, but if you research and choose a safe area you will be able to go out to the beach/mall/bars and what not without being paranoid. I agree with most of what Raphael says, Mexico aint a lot safer. The country itself is amazing, Rio de Janeiro for instance have great weather all year, not mentioning the OUTSTANDING women :). Having said that, my only concern would be on obtaining residency, I am assuming Malta would be easier regarding this specific topic
Honestly, I feel like Vancouver might be the perfect place based on the things you've said. It's not amazingly hot all year round, but the weather is nice most of the year. There are beaches, and mountains close by. You said you like winter sports, it doesn't really snow in Vancouver but in Winter Time you are a stone's throw away from world famous ski destinations like Whistler. Beautiful city, I would at least come visit before you make a final decision!
Another point I don't think you really touched on is Live poker. Probably not a huge concern for you, but Vancouver has a lot of casinos, a lot of live poker games, and some pretty good tournament series every now and then. Even if you are primarily an online player, it's nice to have those kind of options in your home city.
Plus the women are friendly and inviting :)
It really depends on the weather. I'd like to live in a place that doesn't have a noticable winter.
Also, I think you have to pay taxes in Canada.
Live poker is awful, so no thanks to that. :)
Well I think you described Monaco but good luck buying your residency :)
so you want a place with violence, tax, bad weather and snakes. am i missing anything
if you're american u have to pay taxes no matter where u make your money
I'm not American.
Do you have a regular job now? And if yes, how does a typical day of your look like?? I mean, how many hours do you work/study/play/number of tables/sleep/other activites/ a day?
What about the visa situation? Should also be a factor, right? Im suprised people mention countrys like Canada and Australia. As a EU citizen how likely is it to be able to stay longterm in those countrys? I always imagined that to be pretty much impossible.
Getting a visa for Malta shouldn't be a problem. Guessing there won't be a problem in Mexico, since they probably want anyone who won't start a gang to stay in their country.
Yup I agree. Malta and Mexico wont be a problem.
Malta + social engineering to become friends with Isaac Haxton = win
Honestly though, i think Malta fits all your needs.
Yep seems like Malta fits your needs the most.
in mexico there are gonna be a few new laws and it may afect online poker
From what I've read about Malta, you have to pay taxes. And it's a lot.
If that's the case, I won't go there.
Does anyone know more about it?
There is a dedicated Malta thread on twoplustwo, have you checked that out?
Should be easy to find, or I can PM you link if you can't.
Do you have to pay taxes in your home country, if you reside in Malta?
You mean bitcoin or e-wallets by sidestepping, right?
I'm not sure what it means tbh. Sorry.
I've just read that it's something you can avoid and haven't delved further. That thread I mentioned is pretty active iirc so there will be some people who can assist I'd bet.
Thanks. I left a message there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVqtXh7T1HY
take a look at this Joe Rogan podcast where he interviews Isaac Haxton he talks about moving abroad for poker the procedures in obtaining residency in Malta
Obtaining residence in Malta would be v different for Ike who is American and someone from Europe (esp within EU). I don't know if Malta are party to Schengen agreement - would guess they are but should be easy to find out...
EU residents can stay as long as they want.
VPN + U.S.
I have been living in both Mexico and Thailand while playing poker fulltime and I would recommend Thailand anytime. Mexico was very difficult to find proper housing and the food constantly made me sick. We lived in Playa del Carmen. This was never a problem in Thailand. Thailand is wonderful and very laid-back and you get to eat their amazing mangos everyday! :)
I'd just head to the UK (no tax!), crush games, and take regular holidays to sunny places during winter with the profit.
The weather sucks in the UK.
Just go to some place where nobody cares about taxes.
I prefer to stay in Europe, and and I'm not a fan of South America, because of the crime rates.
Coul you lend me a million bucks? I'll make sure to send you a Christmas card every year.
Had the idea of Ecuador from poker refugees... But i'm probably just going to head up to Vancouver Canada instead.
How about the Vostok Station? You'll definetely need a heater or you won't survive!
:D
Chael, you're Dutch right? I thought I read somewhere that starting with the legalization of online gambling next year they'll set the tax rate at 20%. I could be mistaken, but that doesn't sound THAT bad.
It's currently 29%, but you can object to paying because they unlawfully take your money.
But I want to get away anyway, so I'm just looking for a good place to stay.
Looks like it will be Malta.
So I assume this objection is done while awaiting some kind of trial to determine whether it's lawful?
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