Anti-tilt (Lopping off the C Game) - Resources, tricks and tips

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Anti-tilt (Lopping off the C Game) - Resources, tricks and tips

I joined RIO recently as part of my "return to poker", primarily for strategy, but I have found in the forums that a lot of posters suffer from the same problem as I do - tilt and a poor mental game - maybe my first poker screen-name (same as here) which was supposed to level opponents might have been a subconscious acknowledgement. In replying I realise that I have a lot of resources and strategies that have helped me and I'd like to share them in the hope that they'll help my fellow sufferers.

We are all on the same path. I don't think anyone needs to be "an expert" to help with this and I hope we can gather a lot of useful resources here. Not sure about how RIO looks on links to (somewhat) competitive products but any links here from me are only for information and none are affiliate links. I suggest that anyone who wants to add something follow a similar pattern and I'm sure a moderator can weed out any problems/spam.

I'll start my recommendations in my next post - Do you think this could be useful? - What have you got? - Look forward to reading. Peace.



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TheRaulrus 11 years, 4 months ago

Interesting post. Definitely think it could be useful. What I usually recommend to players going through tilt and poor mental game strategy is to either read The Mental Game Of Poker (both 1 and 2) by Jared Tender or also give Tommy Angelo's book, Elements of Poker, a try. Or if you would rather visit some sort of site, I'm a fan of poker coach Blake Eastman and his site, SchoolOfCards.com You can either visit that or his YouTube channel titled, School Of Cards. He also has a great new program out for reading live poker tells. His new site is, BeyondTells.com and will be starting this upcoming December. 

Hope this is all useful to someone out there. Best of luck on and off the felt. 

steamer 11 years, 4 months ago

Thanks for that, love Tommy Angelo's stuff, will need to have a look at Blake Eastman - sounds good. Thanks for posting - I kind of got waylaid posting my links but will get it done after I've played for a bit.

TheRaulrus 11 years, 4 months ago

Nice. Sounds good. Also, "Treat Your Poker Like A Business" by Dusty Schmidt is another one of my favorite poker books. It's helped me out a lot and still continues to do so every time I re-read it. 

steamer 11 years, 4 months ago

If you have a kindle, check out those prices because on some of the books you can save a lot. All the links are to Amazon UK, because that's where I live. But you get the description, reviews etc. and I'm sure you guys are clever enough to get the books where you live :)

Books/Audio - About mind management

The Chimp Paradox - Dr Steve Peters This book has some really good ideas but has some issues in how they are expressed (not only are there a chimp a computer and a human, which is fine - but also planets and moons, which seems confusing). The author is a psychiatrist and mind coach to champion athletes. Worth the effort because you do get a simple model and practical tips on how to improve.

How To Stop Worrying And Start Living - Dale Carnegie I have the audio book of this and really like it - but it's really expensive. Haven't read the print version but it's a lot cheaper. A lot of the examples are set a long time ago and there's a bit of religiousness - it's Dale Carnegie after all - but despite all that, it has a certain folksy charm, talks a lot of sense and helped me put things in perspective.

Books/Audio - General (that can shape how you think about things)

Fooled by Randomness: The Hidden Role of Chance in Life and in the Markets - Nassim Nicholas Taleb and The Black Swan: The Impact of the Highly Improbable - Nassim Nicholas Taleb Two of my favourite books ever, particularly Fooled by Randomness. Fun to read. Lot's of common sense and well explained ideas that can make you reconsider a lot of things and a lot of links to further reading and other authors if you want to take it further. 

Thinking, Fast and Slow - Daniel Kahneman Brilliant, easy to read book that gave me a lot of insight into why I (and a lot of other people) do a lot of really stupid things. Once you understand them, you can do something about it. Plus you'll have read a book by a Nobel prize winning economist.

Talent is Overrated: What Really Separates World-Class Performers from Everybody Else - Geoff Colvin and/or Bounce: The Myth of Talent and the Power of Practice - Matthew Syed These two are quite similar and I prefer Talent is Overrated. Bounce gets into some kind of far-out theories later on.

Books - Specifically about Poker and the mental game

The 3 best known, I'm really including these for completeness.  I confess I haven't read them, although I've just decided I'm going to get them for Kindle (the print versions seem like a lot of $$)

Elements of Poker - Tommy Angelo , The Mental Game of Poker - Jared Tendler M.S, Barry Carter, and the second one The Mental Game of Poker 2: Proven Strategies for Improving Poker Skill, Increasing Mental Endurance, and Playing in the Zone Consistently - Jared Tendler (Author), Barry Carter (Contributor) which gets the prize for longest title!

Also I'd agree with TheRaulrus suggestion above that leatherass's Treat Your Poker Like a Business: How to Turn a Hobby Into an Empire - Dusty Schmidt (Author), Scott Brown (Contributor) is worth a read too. Been a while since I read it. Might be time to give it another look.

Video/Audio

I have two suggestions here which are both actually video - but I transcoded the first one to MP3 so I can listen to it anywhere, because I think of it as the definitive starting point for anyone struggling with their mental game:

The Eightfold Path to Poker Enlightenment - Tommy Angelo. Eight episodes, each about 45 minutes. Still on Deuces Cracked - the first Episode is on free view here. If you like it you could get the free trial to get the other episodes. Personally I prefer RIO (a lot) but I really rate this series.

Jason Somerville's free YouTube channel is something else I'd recommend, if only because it's a reminder that playing poker is supposed to be fun. Has some interesting guests (luckychewy today) and makes a good job of explaining his thought processes in actual hands without really trying to teach anything.

I think Jared Tendler does some stuff on one of the other training sites but I don't know where and I haven't watched any.

That's all I've got at the moment. Will try and write up a couple of the tips and tricks tomorrow - didn't realise how long this would take. Hope to see any other suggestions.



TheRaulrus 11 years, 4 months ago

Thanks for those. Another thing I forgot to mention is listening to PokerNews podcast's. They have some useful strategy and tips on those. PokerNews is general is a great website. That's where I follow what's going on in the poker world. They have their own app too available for download on iPhone or Android. 

steamer 11 years, 4 months ago

This is one of the things I am getting better at - particularly on the forums :)

1) Quite often there is no right answer.
2) In poker it's easy to waste time, that could be better spent, deciding what's exactly right with incomplete information. If it's that close it doesn't matter.
3) Just because we think someone's an idiot doesn't mean they're always wrong.


bdon22 11 years, 3 months ago

2 more good non-poker specific books are:

The Art of Learning: An Inner Journey to Optimal Performance - Josh Waitzkin

How to Fail at Almost Everything and Still Win Big - Scott Adams

SPrince 11 years, 3 months ago

I second "The art of Learning" and would like to add "The Awakening of intelligence", by Jiddu Krishnamurti (not another post modern philosopher).

Bdon if you play chess pm me if you`d like to get crushed in some blitz games :).

bdon22 11 years, 3 months ago

I haven't played chess since 8th grade haha! You'd crush me even in non-blitz games :P
Thanks for the book reco, added to my reading list.

steamer 11 years, 3 months ago

Reading Daz's post about having a mental game section, reminded me I said I would post drills and tips in here, and I played a hand badly in an MTT yesterday which cost me $EV, where it shouldn't have. So here's what happened and the kind of practice I use to get out of this bad habit.

Deep in an MTT, 900 runners, 40 remain, lost a big flip when there were 70 players and have been short stack ninja-ing for a while. I have 9BB w antes and look at 77 on BU - "that's going in", I think to myself. UTG limps. He is short as well, has been shoving a lot and maintaining his stack. I've played 100+ hands with him, he never has worse than KK here - so why do I shove 77 and bust with no FE and 19% equity?

Why do I convince myself that he could have enough AQ+, or a baby pair that he could fold when this player here never has? - The answer is I am anchored to my first thought which was "that's going in". My brain has made up a logical reason for carrying out a decision I already made. It hasn't taken the new information into account because I've become attached to a course of action. If you are interested in anchoring and all the other biases that we all have there is a ton of information in "Thinking Fast and Slow" (there's a link in the resources post above).

The drill I use in a practice session, which also helps with other things like thinking about peoples ranges and stacks, but also trains me to not anchor is: Switch on Options > Table Display Options > Hide Hole Cards in Pokerstars, which will hide your cards until you mouse over them. (You can do a similar thing with an opaque HUD panel on other sites.)

Now just carry on and play as usual. Don't mouse over your cards until you've decided what you should do with which ranges. Talk out loud if you like, pretend your Nick Rampone or Phil Galfond (other instructors are available) - have fun with it.

Good 3B opportunity? Does my hand matter? How good should it be? Any A or broadways or connectors? What should I flat? Is the shortie behind me likely to shove? etc, etc, etc. You will expend a lot of mental energy doing this to find you have 72o and have to fold, and obviously you can't give this much thought to many tables. I learn something every time and hopefully one day it will all stick.

Wow, that's kind of tldr :) Peace.


Daz 11 years, 3 months ago

yes, when i am tired or playing less than my A-Game or both, i have more attachment to my hands and can't find a fold with my premium holdings when information suggests i'm now beat. i'm usually up against Erratic players so i'm looking to get it in wider, but then there is a piece of info that i have that i should be weighting my decision more heavily towards that in the end i choose to ignore and make the call anyway. 

using Tendler's jargon, being able to make disciplined folds lies in the realm of Conscious Competence - something i do well when playing my A/B Game but something that disappears when i'm tired/tilting. when i'm truly focused my ability to make great laydowns comes very naturally. 

steamer 11 years, 3 months ago

Daz, I think that's a good point about making disciplined folds. I have read the first of JT's books now. In the way he speaks about it, I think the point here is that using this drill, or any other methods is about training more decisions to a level of unconscious competence so that you have more conscious competence available for even harder decisions.

Chael Sonnen 11 years, 3 months ago

Steamer, awesome tip on hiding the cards.
I usually break hands down like one of my friends was siiting next to me, or if I were making a coaching video, explaining every acttion you take.
Auto-piloting is horrible for poker improvement, so double checking every decision and dicussing the logic behind it is super important.

steamer 11 years, 3 months ago

Glad you like it Chael. Strangely enough just before writing it I read your answer on how to construct ranges and that would definitely fit in well with this approach.

It could even be useful to take it a level further and record a session and then watch it back, using the appropriate tools (PPT, Flopzilla, ICMizer) to check our own reasoning - self coaching if you like. 

Depends on how much time you have to devote to improvement and I personally have to watch out that I don't become so interested in analysis that I forget to play - becoming a keyboard jockey is just another form of tilt imo.

steamer 11 years, 3 months ago

Kind of tired today - thought about firing up a couple of tables and then realised it would be setting money on fire, so I'll use the spare time to share a tip I've found useful, instead. It's probably a Cognitive Behavioural Therapy technique if you wanted to stick a fancy label on it. Here goes.

I keep a hand written selection of "scripts" on index cards that I review from time to time and sometimes I'll put specific ones where I can see them while I play, if I've identified something I should be working on or have a problem with. The typical format is:

Steamer, you get curious when a random player shoves all in in a strange spot and tend to call too much. Now calling might be the right option and he might be full of shit, but let's consider this exact position carefully and make the right decision. Why not just fold if it's close. You need the practice.
Steamer, you sometimes play when you aren't prepared, don't have enough time or shouldn't be playing for other reasons. It's usually because you have time to spare and you like playing poker. The thing is we have an agreement to only play when you are ready to play your best. Are you really prepared to commit the time and effort right now? You enjoy playing well, much more than mindlessly losing buy ins and you could review hands or watch a video instead. That will help you have fun in future. 

Do I actually address myself by my screen name? No, I'm not 100% mental. But I do use my real name :) So that's the technique and it works for me. I was interested to see Phil Galfond referencing something very similar in his AMA (I'd link to it, but I don't really want to reread 100's of posts on reddit, sorry.) Also Nick Rampone replied in another thread that he does something similar with notes he has written up in Notepad.

The underlying theory is well explained in the book, The Chimp Paradox and a good script should allow you to exercise the chimp (that is acknowledge your underlying reason for doing the bad behaviour), suggest a better course of action and reinforce why it is a better course of action. If I catch myself doing something stupid during a session I'll make a note and if it seems worthwhile I make up a script card for it.

I could go on (a lot) but that's probably enough. Peace.



scourrge 11 years, 2 months ago

I am not by any means a mental game expert, but I have spent a lot of time energy learning about mental game, how to improve it, and also working on my own mental game. It seems to me that while some resources out there can be informative and helpful (I've used some of the ones that were listed here in the past), I think that most people don't appreciate the sheer amount of work that goes into improving their mental game. I feel like a lot of people have this mentality like: "Mental Game of Poker? Jared Tendler's supposed to be awesome - all my mental problems are going to be fixed when I read this book!!"

And then they go off and play hard, maybe things go well for a while, and then they tilt hard and realize that not much has changed. Mental game is all about how we feel and react to poker situations. So much of that is rooted in habits - to change our mental game we must change our habits. And that's rough. Speaking as someone who read Mental Game twice and listened to Tommy Angelo's Eightfold Path about 8 times, it's not just about understanding the problems. It's abut taking steps, baby ones  if necessary, toward creating new habits that encourage us to understand variance, realize fish sometimes win, have realistic expectations, and the list goes on.

That being said, I think this thread is a solid place for anyone to start, and I look forward to seeing what else comes to be in here.

flash2717 11 years, 2 months ago

Sccourge is the man as usual in my opinion.  I have just started working on the things he is talking about.  I also have read "The Mental Game of Poker" going on a 2nd time now.  I didn't really get as much out of it the 1st time as I will this time.  I have made some huge changes in my poker process.  I am applying my old College gold rituals and routines to it.  When you play golf you have routines before every shot to help you vision the shot and to help calm your nerves and help you think straight during key moments.  I worked very hard at this in golf to the point of exhaustion.  I wanted to be prepared and not lose.  I hated to lose.  I learned how my emotions would affect me from shot to shot, hole to hole, round to round. I had to learn a way to relax and concentrate on the process of hitting a good shot not "you just missed that 3 foot putt, JACKASS!" Sorry I had to throw in the Happy Gilmore reference. After all the practice on the course and energy I put into my mental game, I now knew what most of my strengths and weaknesses were and could work on correcting them. From what I remember it took me almost a full year to really get a grip on what It really meant to have a good mental game at golf and I continued to work on it until the day I quit the game. These are just some of the things I am doing right now to improve my poker game. 

I also am doing a presession routine now just like I did at golf.  I meditate for about 10 minutes to an awesome MP3 a gentleman sent me for poker players.  It's amazing.  Email me or PM me if you would like it.  Then I sit down and write down in a poker journal 3-5 things I am going to do or work on during that session.  I keep it open and try to look at it from time to time during my session and remember those things and try and be true to them 100%.  I had better be bc I am also doing a post session where I am completely honest with myself on how I did on those 3-5 things I wrote down. I grade myself 1 to 10 on each of them and also write little comments in there about some of my thoughts I had when I was playing. Everything from, "You tilted hard for 10 minutes" to "Relaxed and took a deep breathe and felt much better after taking a tough beat, and I am very proud of myself for that."

Here's and example of my new presession routine that I write down from my journal today.

1) No playing higher than 100NL!!!

2) Work on playing a little more tight OOP

3)  DO NOT look at my BR during the entire session

4) Pick your spots poker is forever

5) Remeber how you approached the mental game when you played golf, and use this experience to my advantage by using the relaxation techniques I learned


I apologize for the length but I get on a roll sometimes

And as always stay on the DISCIPLINED GRIND

4-Star_General 11 years ago

flash2717

A long time ago a RIO user post a great idea regarding a poker journal... you should take a look at Google Forms... basically, you will have a custom questionarie that you are going to fill every session, whenever you want you can evaluate all your replies in a very efficient way, since you will have an excel spreadsheet to work on. I used to be like you, fill out a kind of journal (I used Gcal) but Google Form is just better, check it out

KingofKaos 11 years ago

I think like most things you need to find out what works for you. I agree that the mental game is huge and is possibly the most common cause of people remaining at low stakes for years. I've come up with the following routine which I try and go through. Happy to receive any feedback or suggestions on improvement. I created this after reading about the inchworm concept in the mental game of poker and felt like I wasn't doing enough to correct leaks so I have huge variations in my game, from playing amazing to playing like the worst fishy player ever.

The other thing I know about myself is that at this stage I can't play more than 4 tables of PLO, I just can't think through the decisions or take in the necessary information fast enough.



Preparation
– Pre session





Review short-term and long-term goals.





Remind yourself why you are playing and what your successes will look
like



When
preparing for my actual poker session, I create a list of achievable goals
which I want to achieve for this session. I create these goals to help try to
combat my greatest weaknesses and use previous evaluations or analysis to see
where these areas are.





List
goals for session – only 1 or 2.





Examples
- folding when very likely beat, finishing session after an hour, common leaks,
folding flops (when T bet is likely which I would have to fold to), not feeling
tilted.



Performance – during play



Use a
notepad to write any in game errors or observations

Mark hands with PT – e.g. where unsure of equity/decision



Gauge
feelings as playing, write down what I find titling and quit if too tilted.



Any other
observations



Evaluation – post play





Score scale of 1-5, 1 = excellent, 2 = good, 3 = average, 4 = poor, 5 =
very poor

Achievement of session goals

Not playing too many tables

Focus on the session



Though Processes

Concentration - not just clicking buttons

Tilt-control – not feeling tilted

Range reading skills

Decision making



Not looking at results



Quitting early (if appropriate).



Analysis



Review any marked hands – post in forum if appropriate



Note down
any future goals or weaknesses to be addressed



Any Amendments to learning process required

rungoodgid 11 years ago

Possibly the best thread I've ever found...  More than I'll get through in the forseeable future.  Thanks.

Zoty79 10 years, 11 months ago

Hi,

i have also big tilt issues. Me for my part i have decided to play just 1 Table Rush for a full Month. The Plan behind is, to concentrate on every Hand, to observe the hole table, and decide my actions on the infos i get. The other thing is, when i dont have 2-3 tough desicions, or suck outs at the same time, it tilts me less. I am Playing NL10, but after 3 Days my winrate took a turnaround from -0,60 to +15bb/100 in 4000 Hands. I Know, the Sample is small, but the direction is clear. Try it, it is very helpfull for the mindset in my opinion!!

luckydont 10 years, 10 months ago

I personally use http://pokerwarmup.com to prepare myself before almost every session and sometimes during the breaks (I play HU, upto nl1k). It's done very much like Jared Tendler recommends in his book, but have some additional kewl features like Brain games and Session Timer. It's still in Beta, but they promised to change to a nice design and add new features like cool down and Dumping the Downswing very soon. 

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