Only had time to catch the first ~13 minutes so far, but I think your "theme" was a brilliant idea. Definitely seems smart to mix these type of vids in once in a while.
The analysis is really sharp. Seeing you use single sizings is really helpful for understanding what one, in a very loose and general sense, should be doing with their range in a given spot.
This is especially true because you're explaining what you would do differently had you been using multiple sizings. In a normal video where you're using multiple sizings, it can be a little more difficult to extrapolate information because it can be hard to tell if what you decided to do only represents a small subsection of your strategy rather than a large portion.
Can't wait to finish watching later on. Thanks Ben!
Definitely liked the video and the idea of having a unique topic or theme for each video. But, I've gotta give some love to the theory videos and the ones that make your head hurt. I think I get more out of those than anything simply because they get me thinking about poker in different way.
Hey Ben! I like the new format better. I find that structuring each session with a specific goal in mind is more efficient for viewers to follow along with. Also, I think showing solid game plans against tough line-up's is nice in that it is my guess that most of the viewers here cannot implement the same strategies (as accurately as you) in previous videos because knowing your frequencies per hand is very important. This is the reason why it's tough to implement your style or Galfond's style and probably ends up with most guys just doing it because sauce did it and not realizing that their frequencies are way different without doing off the table work.
AK3 flop w/TT @ 23m
I've always just c-bet this board with my entire range here for 1/3 pot. We have a big range advantage since our opponents rarely slow play AK or have AA/KK so it would seem that we can just bet 1/3 in these spots and not worry about it. What is the idea behind checking this flop? What is the idea behind going 2/3? You explained it but I didn't quite get that and never expected a check. This board is very dry which makes me like 1/3 even more.
I plugged this into PIO with a standard linear 3-bet range of 10-11% SB and a loose-ish cold call range mixed with various weights on questionable hands for a CO call of 15-20%. It seemed PIO preferred the 1/3 pot sizing the most with 2/3 coming in a close second. A check was virtually never used by PIO so expanding upon why you like check here would be awesome. Cheers!
Eric, I think we're probably using very different preflop ranges. Getting to the flop with 15-20% of hands vs a 3b CO vs SB seems much too loose to me.
Thanks Ben. I plugged in a range of around 10-12% for a tighish cold call (my games are way looser) in the cutoff and it didn't change anything. PIO still never checks and favors betting 1/3 pot 63% with 2/3 pot coming in second at 35% when I enter 33/50/66 bet sizings. It never bets half pot.
What are your thoughts on PIO's strategy choice? Also what is the idea behind a check here?
I was thinking exactly the same thing. I would cbet almost my entire range for 1/3 pot here and I thought "Great I have completely misunderstood the 1/3 concept and I'm confused even in Bens simple strat video"
@ Hypage: I think you're right. What's nice about going 1/3 when we have range adv. is that we avoid flop mistakes leading into turn/river mistakes since we can use almost our entire range and lose very little equity. Nick Howard did a nice video on this.
The real challenge is playing turn and rivers in these spots and it seems like PIO does quite a bit of tricky checking after 1/3 potting the flop in most spots as opposed to how the population plays. I think the real value is finding out how a 1/3 pot strategy leads into our turn and river frequencies considering PIO's strategy is largely interconnected. I think it would be a big mistake to 1/3 pot the flop without having a solid plan on turns and rivers. My guess is that there are a lot of players who think they can 1/3 pot a bunch of spots without considering how the rest of the hand is going to play out.
The video provides a nice contrast and puts the more complicated approach in context -- you can see the more intricate strategy as an evolution from the simpler.
I enjoy seeing you make videos you feel passionate about and motivated to make. This produces the best work IMO.
Definitely very helpful format for mass table grinders , but I personally prefer your crazy style with all of funky sizes and lines out of the box. Such a fun !
Btw is there any chance to see some footage of your recently matches with Educa or 3handed 5k ante?
This video is a great balance for all the previous videos with a lot of complicated things! Great one. I think it is very benefitial for everyone to come back to the basics every once in a while and make sure that we're not making things too complicated, prevents us from making a lot of mistakes due to the complexity of our strategies.
This was a very good video. Makes our though process very clear about poker.
Could you explain the following terms - and the reasoning for the sizing choice
- "i am going to bet smaller and at a high frequency on that flop because i am pushing a lot of equity"
- "i dont think betting small makes sense because his range is high equity"
12min JT hand : dont you think AA and AK KJ types of hands are interesting in betting the turn and a psb won't fit these hands ? Even more so for the river : AA AK should be interested in betting shouldn't they ? Dont really understand how it can be max ev to use 1.5x sizing if we use only one betsize on the river.
I'm trying to maximize my EV with my sizing choices, I wouldn't really dig too deep into the stuff I say when I have <5sec to explain something rly complicated.
When you're using one sizing, you're giving up EV with some combos to make more with other combos. You're probably overestimating the EV of betting AK-AA, in the best case scenarios, betting is only a little better than checking.
In answering the previous question, you said, "When you're using one sizing, you're giving up EV with some combos to make more with other combos." Can you elaborate a bit? I understand how say not allowing ourselves to have a big over betting size on some rivers would likely cost us some EV, but what it is an example of how having one size would help us gain EV in other situations? When you say this, are you assuming our opponents will come to know our strategy/ranges, and for that reason we might realize some EV because of the way our ranges are constructed that we otherwise wouldn't have?
39:14 villain having the Ah, would you be more tempted to keep this AQ combo in his calling range on the flop or is this always a standard way to play this combo for villain? ty
Hi Ben, great video and i think its a good idea to be mixing this kind of simple strat video sometimes.
I have a question regarding your preflop btn vs ep. you folded 77 to a 3x and said you would be 3betting 88's here. aren't these hands just perfectly fine to be flatting as part of our calling range? can you explain why 3bet > call here? is this due to the 3x sizing?
Do you think we give up alot of EV by not having a flatting range ?
Obviously hard to say how much ... but maybe it could be worth it for mass multitablers or people who are just grinding alot of hours to free up that mental space from all the cold calling if it´s not adding alot of EV ?
This isn't directly measurable. I think one attempt to measure it would be to find the subset of +EV flatcall hands that can't appear in a 3b range. If all the combos that appear in both the 3b/flat range are indifferent, then the added EV of the flatcall range will be equal to the sum of the increased VPIP range's EV.
loved this! I enjoy the simple strategies, as It's hard to understand a lot of the more complicated multiple bet sizing ones.
That being said I had a couple of questions.
Why is ATo BTN vs CO a fold and KQo a 3-bet?
When exactly is it right to use an over-bet sizing? (I think you contradicted yourself talking about when they have a x/r range)
This video was great; I would love to have more of these simple style videos. I like to tap in to your line of thinking but I don't frequently play high up so having the fundamentals explained really helps my game. This perhaps one of the most useful videos I've watched.
Hi Sauce. Nice vid. I get the raise or fold strategy. Just a quick qns. I saw you 3- bet KQo to a cutoff open and then a few hands later, you folded A10 off to a cutoff open. Can I get you reasoning behind that? Isnt A10 better than KQ?
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Only had time to catch the first ~13 minutes so far, but I think your "theme" was a brilliant idea. Definitely seems smart to mix these type of vids in once in a while.
The analysis is really sharp. Seeing you use single sizings is really helpful for understanding what one, in a very loose and general sense, should be doing with their range in a given spot.
This is especially true because you're explaining what you would do differently had you been using multiple sizings. In a normal video where you're using multiple sizings, it can be a little more difficult to extrapolate information because it can be hard to tell if what you decided to do only represents a small subsection of your strategy rather than a large portion.
Can't wait to finish watching later on. Thanks Ben!
Definitely liked the video and the idea of having a unique topic or theme for each video. But, I've gotta give some love to the theory videos and the ones that make your head hurt. I think I get more out of those than anything simply because they get me thinking about poker in different way.
yep waiting for toy gaming pt 5
I liked this video more than most of the concept videos and hope to see more like this one.
I also enjoyed the new theme and hope you make more similar!
Hey Ben! I like the new format better. I find that structuring each session with a specific goal in mind is more efficient for viewers to follow along with. Also, I think showing solid game plans against tough line-up's is nice in that it is my guess that most of the viewers here cannot implement the same strategies (as accurately as you) in previous videos because knowing your frequencies per hand is very important. This is the reason why it's tough to implement your style or Galfond's style and probably ends up with most guys just doing it because sauce did it and not realizing that their frequencies are way different without doing off the table work.
I've always just c-bet this board with my entire range here for 1/3 pot. We have a big range advantage since our opponents rarely slow play AK or have AA/KK so it would seem that we can just bet 1/3 in these spots and not worry about it. What is the idea behind checking this flop? What is the idea behind going 2/3? You explained it but I didn't quite get that and never expected a check. This board is very dry which makes me like 1/3 even more.
Thanks!
I plugged this into PIO with a standard linear 3-bet range of 10-11% SB and a loose-ish cold call range mixed with various weights on questionable hands for a CO call of 15-20%. It seemed PIO preferred the 1/3 pot sizing the most with 2/3 coming in a close second. A check was virtually never used by PIO so expanding upon why you like check here would be awesome. Cheers!
Eric, I think we're probably using very different preflop ranges. Getting to the flop with 15-20% of hands vs a 3b CO vs SB seems much too loose to me.
Thanks Ben. I plugged in a range of around 10-12% for a tighish cold call (my games are way looser) in the cutoff and it didn't change anything. PIO still never checks and favors betting 1/3 pot 63% with 2/3 pot coming in second at 35% when I enter 33/50/66 bet sizings. It never bets half pot.
What are your thoughts on PIO's strategy choice? Also what is the idea behind a check here?
Online just plays a lot tighter/trickier preflop these days so I don't think we get to put that much money in on AKx.
I was thinking exactly the same thing. I would cbet almost my entire range for 1/3 pot here and I thought "Great I have completely misunderstood the 1/3 concept and I'm confused even in Bens simple strat video"
@ Hypage: I think you're right. What's nice about going 1/3 when we have range adv. is that we avoid flop mistakes leading into turn/river mistakes since we can use almost our entire range and lose very little equity. Nick Howard did a nice video on this.
The real challenge is playing turn and rivers in these spots and it seems like PIO does quite a bit of tricky checking after 1/3 potting the flop in most spots as opposed to how the population plays. I think the real value is finding out how a 1/3 pot strategy leads into our turn and river frequencies considering PIO's strategy is largely interconnected. I think it would be a big mistake to 1/3 pot the flop without having a solid plan on turns and rivers. My guess is that there are a lot of players who think they can 1/3 pot a bunch of spots without considering how the rest of the hand is going to play out.
Obv great stuff, but please make the tables the same size. It annoyes an OCD guy like me that the card are bigger on the right table :)
The video provides a nice contrast and puts the more complicated approach in context -- you can see the more intricate strategy as an evolution from the simpler.
I enjoy seeing you make videos you feel passionate about and motivated to make. This produces the best work IMO.
Sauce your dog is cute.
I prefer live play but with all the fancyness and complex strats in it
Nice video as always.Thank you.
Definitely very helpful format for mass table grinders , but I personally prefer your crazy style with all of funky sizes and lines out of the box. Such a fun !
Btw is there any chance to see some footage of your recently matches with Educa or 3handed 5k ante?
This video is a great balance for all the previous videos with a lot of complicated things! Great one. I think it is very benefitial for everyone to come back to the basics every once in a while and make sure that we're not making things too complicated, prevents us from making a lot of mistakes due to the complexity of our strategies.
34:19 sick snap break!!!! teach me how to do it? did u fly in time?
Really enjoyed this video thanks ben
Id prefer you that you try to be as creative and max EV as possible. Seeing how you view certain spots is the most valuable thing you offer imo.
Best video I have seen for a long time, thanks Ben! :)
This was a very good video. Makes our though process very clear about poker.
Could you explain the following terms - and the reasoning for the sizing choice
- "i am going to bet smaller and at a high frequency on that flop because i am pushing a lot of equity"
- "i dont think betting small makes sense because his range is high equity"
12min JT hand : dont you think AA and AK KJ types of hands are interesting in betting the turn and a psb won't fit these hands ? Even more so for the river : AA AK should be interested in betting shouldn't they ? Dont really understand how it can be max ev to use 1.5x sizing if we use only one betsize on the river.
I'm trying to maximize my EV with my sizing choices, I wouldn't really dig too deep into the stuff I say when I have <5sec to explain something rly complicated.
When you're using one sizing, you're giving up EV with some combos to make more with other combos. You're probably overestimating the EV of betting AK-AA, in the best case scenarios, betting is only a little better than checking.
I liked the focus on simplified strategies. It's much easier to translate this sort of stuff into my own game.
In answering the previous question, you said, "When you're using one sizing, you're giving up EV with some combos to make more with other combos." Can you elaborate a bit? I understand how say not allowing ourselves to have a big over betting size on some rivers would likely cost us some EV, but what it is an example of how having one size would help us gain EV in other situations? When you say this, are you assuming our opponents will come to know our strategy/ranges, and for that reason we might realize some EV because of the way our ranges are constructed that we otherwise wouldn't have?
Watch my Toy Gaming series or read mathematics of poker.
Like this allot!
39:14 villain having the Ah, would you be more tempted to keep this AQ combo in his calling range on the flop or is this always a standard way to play this combo for villain? ty
I think AQ is a mix strategy on flop, heavily favoring call.
Come on! This video deserves at least 100 likes!
Hi Ben, great video and i think its a good idea to be mixing this kind of simple strat video sometimes.
I have a question regarding your preflop btn vs ep. you folded 77 to a 3x and said you would be 3betting 88's here. aren't these hands just perfectly fine to be flatting as part of our calling range? can you explain why 3bet > call here? is this due to the 3x sizing?
I wasn't implementing a flat call range during this video.
you missed the entire point of the video :P rewatch it now!
Hi Ben, I strongly vote for the hardcore analysis video type of you rather than live play. Always good to hear your thoughts in-game though.
nice video Ben, i like to see more fancy videos tho haha
Do you think we give up alot of EV by not having a flatting range ?
Obviously hard to say how much ... but maybe it could be worth it for mass multitablers or people who are just grinding alot of hours to free up that mental space from all the cold calling if it´s not adding alot of EV ?
This isn't directly measurable. I think one attempt to measure it would be to find the subset of +EV flatcall hands that can't appear in a 3b range. If all the combos that appear in both the 3b/flat range are indifferent, then the added EV of the flatcall range will be equal to the sum of the increased VPIP range's EV.
I would recommend a 4 table zoom, playing it like you normally do! People will like that, and we can see more hands, which is nice.
I don't agree, but you know, it's all a matter of opinions
loved this! I enjoy the simple strategies, as It's hard to understand a lot of the more complicated multiple bet sizing ones.
That being said I had a couple of questions.
Why is ATo BTN vs CO a fold and KQo a 3-bet?
When exactly is it right to use an over-bet sizing? (I think you contradicted yourself talking about when they have a x/r range)
Great idea with excellent execution.Looking forward to mre videos of this type.
I play PLO, but i love your NLHE videos.
Maybe you could try a 6 Max PLO video for fun :P
Love your videos! Can you tell me what you mean when you say " I don't need to size up because they have a check raising range?"
Thank you !
This video was great; I would love to have more of these simple style videos. I like to tap in to your line of thinking but I don't frequently play high up so having the fundamentals explained really helps my game. This perhaps one of the most useful videos I've watched.
Hi Sauce. Nice vid. I get the raise or fold strategy. Just a quick qns. I saw you 3- bet KQo to a cutoff open and then a few hands later, you folded A10 off to a cutoff open. Can I get you reasoning behind that? Isnt A10 better than KQ?
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